Reviews of Rhino 8

[andrew.nowicki]

What's New in Rhino 8?

Rhino 8 IS HERE! What's New?

Why Rhino 8 is a Huge Deal?

[stijgerart]

I am not sure if I am happy with R 8.
Some mesh problems, and my space mouse suddenly flips direction. I do like some aspect in 8 but for me a working space mouse is a big deal.

[Matthieu_SAMSON]

Hello my dears,

I will also bring my feedback to this topic like @Stijgerart by expressing my disappointments with Rhino 8.
In my case, I purchased the update from Rhino 7.

And unfortunately, to my great (very great) regret, I was greatly disappointed. Far too many things that worked perfectly before have been changed or even removed. However, I try to enjoy it, but I always end up coming back to Rhino 7. (Perfect in my opinion).
I tell myself with each update that corrections will be made, but unfortunately not.

I will give as an example these few points which I think really deserve to be reviewed:

• Being able to set the antialising to a true 0 as before on Rhino 7. This allows you to clearly visualize a line that is not straight, with a slight slope. And it’s much more pleasing to the eye. (As autocad also allows)

• Being able to delete layers with the del key on the keyboard (please, essential for me, a change had already been made on this in the past and it had been requested by many people)

• I also really miss the Rhino 7 macros allowing you to show and hide a toolbar.
  _Show…_Yes
  _Show… _No
  Now you have to right-click and click close, it’s much longer and more restrictive.

• The management of toolbar placement is less good now and less stable. Additionally, some bars move even when attached.

• Improve the overall speed of Rhino 8, which is much (much) slower than Rhino 7. (Rhino 7 was already not the fastest software when opening and closing the program. Using tabs to managing multiple drawings on the same instance would have been an excellent improvement). But beyond that, the opening of menus, windows, takes much longer and waiting times for certain tasks now which were non-existent before.

• I also had completely improbable displays of certain rendered meshes, even though everything is correct with Rhino 7.

There I have other items for my list, and surely more to come. But for now I no longer use Rhino 8 for all that. I’m really frustrated with these big upheavals. And to this day, I tell myself that this upgrade purchase was not a good investment.

I really hope that these things will be taken into consideration and corrected.

I even find myself questioning my professional suites with Rhino with these changes. For now Rhino 7 works on Windows 11, but what will happen to future versions of Windows, and what to do if the disappointments with the next versions of Rhino increase.

But I believe in the McNeel team’s desire to satisfy its users and I hope that this bottle in the sea will not be in vain.

[Gijs (Gijs de Zwart)]

@stijgerart

Some mesh problems

hello @stijgerart can you clarify this?

@stijgerart

my space mouse suddenly flips direction

and this one too. We have an issue listed of spacemouse jumping in Rhino 8, is that what you see as well?
pls provide your systeminfo

@Matthieu_SAMSON

Being able to set the antialising to a true 0 as before on Rhino 7.

I logged that one a while back based on your feedback.

@Matthieu_SAMSON

Being able to delete layers with the del key on the keyboard

this is still possible:
Set this advanced setting Rhino.Options.General.EnableLayersPanelDeleteKey to True

@Matthieu_SAMSON

I also really miss the Rhino 7 macros allowing you to show and hide a toolbar.
_Show…_Yes
_Show… _No

I’m not familiar with that functionality. There is ShowToolbar, which seems to work still in Rhino 8, albeit a bit differently

@Matthieu_SAMSON

The management of toolbar placement is less good now and less stable. Additionally, some bars move even when attached.

My experience is the opposite, so it would be helpful if you show what you are facing. For me Rhino 7 often used to ‘reset’ itself after a restart.

@Matthieu_SAMSON

Improve the overall speed of Rhino 8, which is much (much) slower than Rhino 7. (Rhino 7 was already not the fastest software when opening and closing the program. Using tabs to managing multiple drawings on the same instance would have been an excellent improvement). But beyond that, the opening of menus, windows, takes much longer and waiting times for certain tasks now which were non-existent before.

On my machine Rhino 8 starts up faster than Rhino 7. Can you specify which things you see are much slower in Rhino 8 than in Rhino 7 when you are working?

@Matthieu_SAMSON

I also had completely improbable displays of certain rendered meshes, even though everything is correct with Rhino 7.

Here also an example would be very helpful.

@Matthieu_SAMSON

to this day, I tell myself that this upgrade purchase was not a good investment.

I’m sorry to hear that, and hope things will improve for you in the next few service releases.
Thanks a lot for your feedback

[jim]

@Matthieu_SAMSON

Being able to set the antialising to a true 0 as before on Rhino 7. This allows you to clearly visualize a line that is not straight, with a slight slope. And it’s much more pleasing to the eye. (As autocad also allows)

Ha! Well that certainly is a refreshing complaint. Every previous complaint about AA for curves , is complaining that Rhino8 AA is crap for curves.

I also like curves in Rhino to be without AA. I don’t think it looks good, but I agree it is functionally useful. Not only does no AA on curves show the user which curves don’t line up to the screen pixel grid it clues users to curves that don’t line up with each other. An example would be two edges of surfaces . With no AA on curves its much easier to see when two surface edges are matched well or not.

Just to be clear, I do like the Rhino8 AA for visualizing surfaces (or meshes).
What I would like to see is a separate AA setting for curves and another setting for AA in general.

[jim]

@Gijs

My experience is the opposite, so it would be helpful if you show what you are facing. For me Rhino 7 often used to ‘reset’ itself after a restart.

Seriously Gijs? You are blaming the bugs introduced in Rhino7 that were never fixed as a justification for additional bugs in Rhino8.
I never used Rhino7. It was too buggy for me. I use Rhino6 and and it has never once reset itself after a restart.

[David53 (David)]

So far, I am enjoying Rhino 8.

So far, I wish_Inset had a function to auto-create a new surface as well as/instead of optionally splitting the original, rather than duplicating, then trimming. It’s been a fantastic tool for panelling. I got sick of pulling curves, projecting endlessly, being in the wrong view…

It would also have been nice if someone would fix the final Cycles 3.3 API function for Intel Arc GPU oneAPI rendering; but it is a properly niche thing, and given the volume of issues at the moment, is way down the list; but it may be useful for others who may eventually come here with mobile Meteor Lake Arc iGPUs or dGPUs (mobile, Alchemist, or future Battlemage).

Other than that, it’s been a generally enjoyable experience, minus the arbitrary lockups. But I have simply changed my workflow to avoid most of the lockups. I have also only had to play toolbar tetris once with bella vanishing.

Shrinkwrapping is also excellent, but mostly a bit of fun for me at the moment. It only seems a shame that drape is not really changing to match, and be more natural or better resolved to be more like a cloth simulation, even if it called out to Kangaroo.

[Mike_A]

Yep, the Spacemouse issue annoys the hell out of me as well.

[Gijs (Gijs de Zwart)]

@jim

Seriously Gijs? You are blaming the bugs introduced in Rhino7 that were never fixed as a justification for additional bugs in Rhino8.

Hi Jim,
I am referring specifically to how the window layouts in Rhino can be saved and restored. I’m not justifying anything. I’ve seen many complaints over the years of people that have their window layout being reset. That is not a problem specific to Rhino 7.
Since my window layout in Rhino 8 opens up as I left it every time, I’m trying to figure out what happens at @Matthieu_SAMSON s end.

[Helvetosaur]

@Matthieu_SAMSON

Using tabs to managing multiple drawings on the same instance would have been an excellent improvement

No, not at at all. IMO an MDI (such as Rhino for Mac is) has only disadvantages:

• If you crash one document (window), all of the other documents you have open also crash.
• It is not possible to run multiple languages simultaneously, in order to change languages you have to close Rhino (all open documents) and restart. Every time.
• Same as above for UI’s (as far as I know) you cannot have a different UI (Window layout, toolbars, etc) for each open window.

@Matthieu_SAMSON

Improve the overall speed of Rhino 8, which is much (much) slower than Rhino 7. (Rhino 7 was already not the fastest software when opening and closing the program

If you are talking about opening Rhino, yes, I would say Rhino 8 is much slower right now when opening the first instance (Windows here). This seems to be all the new Python stuff loading. I think they are working on that.

[stevebaer]

@Helvetosaur

If you crash one document (window), all of the other documents you have open also crash

That isn’t necessarily true. The way browsers do tabs this these days is by orchestrating child processes where each tab gets its own process. It is something we’ve talked about over the years, but it is a pretty massive project.

[stijgerart]

a bit later than was expected but here is my info:
Rhino 7 SR36 2023-12-12 (Rhino 7, 7.36.23346.16351, Git hash:master @ 11a364321297eb8cdb34405a3308d8911f58706d)
License type: Commercial, build 2023-12-12
License details: Cloud Zoo

Windows 11 (10.0.22631 SR0.0) or greater (Physical RAM: 32Gb)

Computer platform: LAPTOP - Plugged in [100% battery remaining]

Hybrid graphics configuration.
Primary display: Intel(R) UHD Graphics (Intel) Memory: 1GB, Driver date: 5-31-2022 (M-D-Y).
> Integrated graphics device with 3 adapter port(s)
- Windows Main Display is laptop’s integrated screen or built-in port
Primary OpenGL: NVIDIA Quadro RTX 3000 (NVidia) Memory: 6GB, Driver date: 10-13-2023 (M-D-Y). OpenGL Ver: 4.6.0 NVIDIA 529.19
> Integrated accelerated graphics device with 4 adapter port(s)
- Video pass-through to primary display device

OpenGL Settings
Safe mode: Off
Use accelerated hardware modes: On
Redraw scene when viewports are exposed: On
Graphics level being used: OpenGL 4.6 (primary GPU’s maximum)

Anti-alias mode: 4x
Mip Map Filtering: Linear
Anisotropic Filtering Mode: High

Vendor Name: NVIDIA Corporation
Render version: 4.6
Shading Language: 4.60 NVIDIA
Driver Date: 10-13-2023
Driver Version: 31.0.15.2919
Maximum Texture size: 32768 x 32768
Z-Buffer depth: 24 bits
Maximum Viewport size: 32768 x 32768
Total Video Memory: 6 GB

Rhino plugins that do not ship with Rhino
C:\Program Files\Rhino 7\Plug-ins\RhinoCAM 2022 for R7\RhinoArt1FileExporter For Rhino7.0.rhp “RhinoArt1FileExporter”
C:\Program Files\Rhino 7\Plug-ins\RhinoCAM 2022 for R7\RhinoCAM 2022 For Rhino7.0.rhp “RhinoCAM 2022 - The cutting edge CAM plug-in for Rhino 7.0 from MecSoft Corporation”
C:\ProgramData\McNeel\Rhinoceros\7.0\Plug-ins\Datasmith Rhino Exporter (d1fdc795-b334-4933-b680-088119cdc6bb)\DatasmithRhino7.rhp “Datasmith Exporter” 5.0.3.0
C:\Users\stijg\AppData\Roaming\McNeel\Rhinoceros\7.0\Plug-ins\Twinmotion Direct Link 2020.2 (e24ee14a-9514-47da-8fe6-f6e61b20160e)\Twinmotion Direct Link 2020.rhp “Twinmotion Direct Link 2020” 1.0.6.0

Rhino plugins that ship with Rhino
C:\Program Files\Rhino 7\Plug-ins\Commands.rhp “Commands” 7.36.23346.16351
C:\Program Files\Rhino 7\Plug-ins\rdk.rhp “Renderer Development Kit”
C:\Program Files\Rhino 7\Plug-ins\RhinoRenderCycles.rhp “Rhino Render” 7.36.23346.16351
C:\Program Files\Rhino 7\Plug-ins\rdk_etoui.rhp “RDK_EtoUI” 7.36.23346.16351
C:\Program Files\Rhino 7\Plug-ins\rdk_ui.rhp “Renderer Development Kit UI”
C:\Program Files\Rhino 7\Plug-ins\NamedSnapshots.rhp “Snapshots”
C:\Program Files\Rhino 7\Plug-ins\RhinoCycles.rhp “RhinoCycles” 7.36.23346.16351
C:\Program Files\Rhino 7\Plug-ins\Toolbars\Toolbars.rhp “Toolbars” 7.36.23346.16351
C:\Program Files\Rhino 7\Plug-ins\3dxrhino.rhp “3Dconnexion 3D Mouse”
C:\Program Files\Rhino 7\Plug-ins\Displacement.rhp “Displacement”
C:\Users\stijg\AppData\Roaming\McNeel\Rhinoceros\packages\7.0\PanelingTools\2021.3.2.446\PanelingTools.rhp “PanelingTools”

[stijgerart]

the problem with the mesh was that when I edit points of the meshes to get them togeter, like 2 or more mesh faces to stitch them I drag the ponts to connect. when I do, Rhino crashes! Thanks

[Nathan_Bossett]

@Helvetosaur

No, not at at all. IMO an MDI (such as Rhino for Mac is) has only disadvantages:

• If you crash one document (window), all of the other documents you have open also crash.
• It is not possible to run multiple languages simultaneously, in order to change languages you have to close Rhino (all open documents) and restart. Every time.
• Same as above for UI’s (as far as I know) you cannot have a different UI (Window layout, toolbars, etc) for each open window.

Supporting MDI is not the same thing as forcing one and only one application instance to be open. I realize that Mac often combines the two, but they’re two different things.

Example: I have two instances of Visual Studio for Windows open right now, each of which is acting as an MDI with a number of documents related to different projects.

IMO, being able to open a family of Rhino models in the same way that VS allows a family of projects in a solution would be a powerful feature for engineering type projects such as for exploring alternative designs and component-based models.

As usual, I recognize that my workflows are often atypical

[jdhill]

they would need to do something about the “raytraced is activated upon opening a file, if it was activated when saved” thing

a couple of times I have made the mistake of clicking file > revert to > browse all versions on a mac, with a heavy file that uses a raytraced (or other similar) viewport

or just fat fingered the wrong model when opening rhino, and have to wait while it fires up the viewport render, until I can then go and open the file I really intended

probably the display mode needs a property that says “I am a heavy display mode”, which is used by a user pref that says “don’t activate heavy display modes when opening files”

[Magda_Banáková1 (Magda Banáková)]

Hello,
my system info:
Rhino 8 SR4 2024-2-13 (Rhino 8, 8.4.24044.15001, Git hash:master @ 5d3f86ffffae3c2ed84d21147c008b3907a40a2e)
License type: Commercial, sestavení 2024-02-13
License details: Cloud Zoo

Windows 10 (10.0.19045 SR0.0) or greater (Physical RAM: 32GB)
.NET 7.0.0

Computer platform: DESKTOP

Standard graphics configuration.
Primary display and OpenGL: Radeon ™ Pro WX 5100 Graphics (AMD) Memory: 8GB, Driver date: 3-30-2023 (M-D-Y). OpenGL Ver: 4.6.0 Compatibility Profile Context 22.20.27.09.230330
> Accelerated graphics device with 7 adapter port(s)
- Windows Main Display attached to adapter port #0

OpenGL Settings
Safe mode: Off
Use accelerated hardware modes: On
Redraw scene when viewports are exposed: On
Graphics level being used: OpenGL 3.3

Anti-alias mode: 8x
Mip Map Filtering: Linear
Anisotropic Filtering Mode: High

Vendor Name: ATI Technologies Inc.
Render version: 4.6
Shading Language: 4.60
Driver Date: 3-30-2023
Driver Version: 31.0.12027.9001
Maximum Texture size: 16384 x 16384
Z-Buffer depth: 24 bits
Maximum Viewport size: 16384 x 16384
Total Video Memory: 24276 MB

Rhino plugins that do not ship with Rhino

Rhino plugins that ship with Rhino
C:\Program Files\Rhino 8\Plug-ins\SolidTools.rhp “NástrojeProTělesa”
C:\Program Files\Rhino 8\Plug-ins\Commands.rhp “Commands” 8.4.24044.15001
C:\Program Files\Rhino 8\Plug-ins\WebBrowser.rhp “WebovýProhlížeč”
C:\Program Files\Rhino 8\Plug-ins\rdk.rhp “Renderer Development Kit”
C:\Program Files\Rhino 8\Plug-ins\RhinoScript.rhp “RhinoScript”
C:\Program Files\Rhino 8\Plug-ins\IdleProcessor.rhp “Nečinný procesor”
C:\Program Files\Rhino 8\Plug-ins\RhinoRenderCycles.rhp “Rhino Render” 8.4.24044.15001
C:\Program Files\Rhino 8\Plug-ins\RhinoRender.rhp “Původní Rhino Render”
C:\Program Files\Rhino 8\Plug-ins\rdk_etoui.rhp “RDK_EtoUI” 8.4.24044.15001
C:\Program Files\Rhino 8\Plug-ins\NamedSnapshots.rhp “Snapshots”
C:\Program Files\Rhino 8\Plug-ins\MeshCommands.rhp “MeshCommands” 8.4.24044.15001
C:\Program Files\Rhino 8\Plug-ins\RhinoCycles.rhp “RhinoCycles” 8.4.24044.15001
C:\Program Files\Rhino 8\Plug-ins\RhinoCode\RhinoCodePlugin.rhp “RhinoCodePlugin” 8.4.24044.15001
C:\Program Files\Rhino 8\Plug-ins\Toolbars\Toolbars.rhp “Toolbars” 8.4.24044.15001
C:\Program Files\Rhino 8\Plug-ins\3dxrhino.rhp “3Dconnexion 3D Mouse”
C:\Program Files\Rhino 8\Plug-ins\Displacement.rhp “Displacement”
C:\Program Files\Rhino 8\Plug-ins\SectionTools.rhp “SectionTools”

I just upgraded from R7 and using R8 few days. Unfortunately, I’m not very excited from R8. Here are my observations, similar as it was here already mentioned:

• R8 seems to be slower than R7
• AA looks worse than in R7 (I know the graphic is not the best for Rhino)
• Managing toolbars is test of patience
• Creating shells works much worse than in R7. I actually tried to make a shell on same simple object in R7 and R8. R7 made the shell well, R8 didn’t. I tried it on more objects with similar results.
• Dark mode is great idea, unfortunately the icons are not adjusted to the dark background and are not good visible.