Rhino 8 Mac

The new Rhino 8 for Mac is full of bugs it makes it impossible to use as a working tool, have been working with rhino for more then a decade, its a pity but will need to start looking for alternatives.

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I’m in the same situation.
How poorly Rhino 8 for Mac has been and is developed is for me an alarm bell for how it’s not worth investing in this software anymore.
What are the alternatives that are you looking at, if I may ask? I’m interested.

This is why earlier upgraders to software get a big discount.

I’ve found a number of problems (see posting) but not enough to panic over. I’ve now illustrated two books with hundreds of 3d drawings using Rhino. My complaints are few.

I’ll keep Rhino 7 installed until the kinks are worked out.

For me the worst thing is the UI has completely changed and makes absolutely no sense to a Mac only user. I’ve never used a PC, I never want to use a PC, why has Rhino been made to look like the PC version.

This is a huge step in the wrong direction and I am not happy at all.

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Hi rh24,

We are getting these addressed on a daily basis, if you have anything to add please see these suggestions for reporting. Thanks

Please define more precisely the things that “make no sense” (to a Mac only user) - other than “It doesn’t look like I’m used to anymore”.

You assume that Rhino for Windows has a PC-like interface. It doesn’t. It has a Rhino-like interface.

It has a Rhino like interface if you’ve been using Rhino for PC, as such I unfortunately do not align with your Rhino has a Rhino like interface. Rhino for Mac, to me, since I’ve been using it since the beta has felt extremely different. Visually they have similarities, but it’s the small subtle differences that have made Rhino for Mac my software of choice for 3D modelling.

Rhino on PC and Rhino on Mac were different, now they’re unified, but they’ve unified to an experience that aligns with the PC versions experience. For me it’s very jarring and surprising. I’m not a fan that Mac users haven’t been given the option to have the look and feel of Mac.

Curious. If you have never used a PC, and never want to use a PC; how do you make judgements on the similarity between the two?

Hello @Forrest_Radford
This is a difficult subject, especially since this cannot be caught in a single bug report. Rhino 8 is the first iteration of a unified Rhino for Mac and PC. This first iteration is far from perfect, but it doesn’t mean we stop here. A generalized 'bring back the look and feel of Rhino for Mac 7" however will not help toward any change. The only road to change is to define more precisely what it is that makes Rhino 7 more agreeable for you to work with.
If I had to say something myself about things I like better in Rhino for Mac version 7, it’s probably the fact that there is more white space. You see this for example in the button toolbars, but also in the Osnap panel
I wonder if you can describe more specifically what elements of Rhino 8 make it jarring for you.

This is not a bug issue, this is a user experience issue.

White space plays into the look and feel for sure, but this is more to do with changing the experience of something.

I disagree with your comment on ‘bring back the look and feel of Rhino for Mac 7’ will not help make any change. It’s precisely when people say this that you need to take notice of the problem - it does not necessarily mean that it is the solution though. Consider yourselves the doctor, I am telling you I am in pain, and it’s your job to listen to that pain and prescribe a solution.

In another post I mention how the best version of Rhino Mac I ever experienced was the beta of Rhino 5.

The solution for Rhino 8 Mac is to focus on understanding how Mac users use Macs and the way software on a Mac is supposed to feel. Take note of how companies like apple do upgrades. They don’t radically change how the OS is expected to feel from one update to the next. There may be additions or small tweaks, but it’s very gradual and always user centric because at the end of the day users are your customers.

To unify the two only makes sense if it’s being done from a user perspective. Right now I imagine it’s been done from a cost saving perspective. Likely resulting in a less than optimal experience on both platforms. I would put money on the kinds of people using Rhino on Mac vs PC to be (if plotted on a bell curve) different. There will be some overlap, but the way they interact and create on it is likely different.

For examples on things that immediately felt odd, rhino 7 I could right click anywhere and change from wireframe to shaded to rendered. This has been removed. Jarring.

When I search for commands it’s not showing what I would expect to be shown first as per the previous iteration. Jarring

Menu bars have been moved or look completely different, not really sure why. The Mac version has always been a better experience in my opinion. This feels like a regression, this feeling is what I think you should pay attention to. If I as a user cannot smoothly transition from 7 to 8 then I think that the team really need to think about why that is. It’s a big enough issue to me that its really put me off wanting to open the software again. If I’m going to have to learn how something works again it opens my options to other software.

Perhaps if there was a very comprehensive change list with videos showing what has changed and where it has moved to the transition could be easier. But why create this work for yourself.

When changing a User Interface and Experience it’s important to recognise what works and why it was put there in the first place. The decisions to change the look and more importantly feel so radically (even if it doesn’t perceptively look like it) must come from users saying something is wrong or missing. Do not conflate a request for more features to needing to change how the workflow is.

I say all of this as someone who works often within user centric design.

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Because I have friends who use Rhino on a PC and ask for my help and it’s like the software is speaking another language. “Never for personal use”

Funny, I had it going in the opposite direction (up to V7) - the ‘friends’ are actually clients and students. That’s actually the point - it’s the SAME software. WHY should it speak another language? That doesn’t make sense to me and never has since the first version of MacRhino was released.

Have you ever taught a class where half the users were on MacRhino and the other half were on Windows Rhino?

the decision to unify was just that, a decision

a reversal of an older decision to make mac rhino different from windows rhino

I would put very low, the likelihood of reversing yet again, so the thing to do is identify specific features & behaviors you preferred before, and see if they can be implemented again in the new system

I was initially taught Rhino from Windows at my uni and followed along on my Mac which was, in my opinion, much easier to navigate.

Like I said earlier, the issue is user experience, I don’t think the direction of the unification was correct. Perhaps it was made on volume of user base, perhaps not. But, I believe there is an issue with this change and it should be resolved.

I’m usually not that vocal about changes like this on software, but also I’ve never opened up a software that I’ve been using for a decade and suddenly felt like I have to relearn how to use it.

hi @Forrest_Radford thanks for your elaborate answer,

Rhino 8 was unified based on customer feedback, in this case it’s the vast amount of teachers around the world that have requested this.

Right click in the viewport to change the display mode is brought back (and is now also available on PC)

I don’t understand what you mean by that, you must be seeing a difference in search result I am not seeing. A small example would be helpful.

please be specific of what you are referring to here. If it is the layer menu, then yes, this has changed, both on Mac and PC. It had to be done, to unify and for the fact that new functions were added.

Apart from the bugs above, that can be addressed rather quickly, there isn’t an easy answer to your more general statement that Rhino 8 has changed too much for existing Rhino for Mac users. This is food for internal debate.

thanks god… is it in the 8.5 version? i was just thinking about this right now… funny.

is set view also going to be there?

Seems you’re right. But I just hope our time spent reporting/helping/complaining/teaching actually amounts to something.

For R8, I feel like a beta that came out around a year ago had such major UI and other problems that I gave up on even trying to use it until those problems got smoothed out, letting other users post in better terms than I could muster. But then the full R8 eval version came out, chock full of elementary mistakes that feel just untested, and I fear that the input I could have offered earlier (see a bunch of my recent posts) might go ignored.

I admit that I may sound complainy sometimes, but I usually consider my feedback objectively valuable and actually useful. If I didn’t think it would help improve Rhino, I’d stop, just let it feel buggy forever after, and resent using it even though it’s critical for my work. But I really do care, I’m frustrated, and I hope I’m actually helping for the long term.

yes and it looks like this

i would wish for it to contain the set view either.

currently when you navigate to the corner to the title of the viewport we get the following see below, which would be in my opinion better to have standard for where ever you click.

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Thank you for your feedback.

I’d love to be able to show you the difference but I cannot get Rhino 5 to run on my Mac anymore to show you differences, nor Rhino 7 as I only used the evaluation license and don’t have a license for it, only 8.

In regards to the point about teachers… I will say that I appreciate that as a reason, but when I’m trying to deliver projects for my clients it really makes me wonder if you considered industry professionals under the teachers needs. I’m delivering projects where things need to work how I expect them to work, if they don’t then I’ll move to different software, then all those people taught Rhino at Uni or other will come into a workplace where people like me may have made the decision to switch software due to this. Food for thought.

Glad to hear somethings being brought back, begs the question why it was missing in the first place.

In regards to the search bar, when I type in “dim” for example, the first result used to be dimensions, now it’s not. Same for some other commands, it’s unexpected and again, doesn’t work how expected. And then due to the change in UI I don’t know where to find the command I used to type out only the first few letters of (and not know the whole command, so now I’m lost in a sea of commands that I don’t remember).

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