Drafting, Layouts, Details need more love

For some manual i tried to set up as much as possible in rhino layouts and i failed. i came across so many issues…

I came across so many unpleasant aspects … and i hope that my love to rhino can be seen in the following report:

details highlight

if a detail is selected - it s highlight is not front-most:


here is a selected detail - you can see it in properties but not in the view

set up


i made a simplified version - i have 4 details - each shows one step of the manual. There is some additional stuff in the layout space - represented by some random text as curves.

locked / uncentered camera

the details are locked but i need to adapt their size to have the shadow below the text - so _pointsOn for the detail and adapt it to maximum size:


doing this for all details the layout is destroyed

my wish: details should behave like Frames that crop cameras (infinite) image. In standard viewports in Model space it completely makes sense that the camera / target is always in the center of the image.
In layout / Details that does not. This issue for sure will arise with non-rectangular details in V9 (have not tested - i am on a intel mac).

  • cropping behaviour of cplanes
  • non - centered camera
  • recenter camera
  • straighten camera rotation

leave detail - enter next detail

current behaviour - if a detail is active and I double click on another detail - this detail is directly activated.

i would expect:
double click on detail → activated
double click outside - no matter where → deactivate detail, focus in layoutspace / paper.
double click on another detail → activated

so i miss a step inbetween - leaving the detail.
current behaviour feels like being beamed from one room to another without using the corridor in between. if you do not see any geometry and want to zoom out - and have an unlocke detail you destroyed your setup.

stacked details / combine raster - vector


ok there is a huge potential in combining details on top of each other.
here i stacked an Arctic Display Mode below a Copy of Technical without hidden curves
this has huge potential as it outputs raster background and vector top.
03_stacked_details.pdf (1.8 MB)

but it s nearly impossible to get it nice:

as soon as I activate one detail - drawing Order is messed up. (print order not ?)

Drawing / Printing Order

in general is discussed at many places but I still miss the best practice guide that works with all object types and describes the hierarchy (_bringToFront / _sendBack … Layers, resorted Layers etc…)

Print Width / Line Weights

the challenge would be to have the technical Display being printed at the same Print Width / Line Weight as the “just some … fancy …” Curves.
this is print display on:

that s the pdf:

pdf structure

so as I always did - we need illustrator or affinity designer (wich is free since end of october)

but my objects are set up as blocks.
and the Rhino pdf writer messes up the pdf structure with many many empty layers:

not only look at the long list - but look at the scroll bar !!!

please update the pdf writer to not create empty layers !

tangent Edges

… ok i found that - technical does not distinguish between “tangent” and general edges - why this different names ?

wireframe

technical

Display Modes Interface

I somehow managed (with a name that was to long ?) to mess up my left column with the list of Display modes. - this one is mac specific.

..reframe
Wireframe
^^missing !!!

Display Modes

… and as my document relies on display mode - it will not look the same on my colleagues machine.
I think there should be document specific display modes.

more

there is more - but i am tired of writing it all down. sorry.
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thanks for more love to layouts / drafting / …

And with more love i do not mean new features - I mean reliable everyday workflows.

sorry for being a bit angry.

thanks for having a look

kind regards - tom

layoutLovePlease.3dm (4.6 MB)

Everything needs more love in this software some things are so annoying I am thinking about regressing back to V5 :joy:

Just a hint. You don’t have to click outside of the detail at 2nd step. Double-click on any empty space of the activated detail and it will be deactivated with focus moved to the layout space.

A resource worth bookmarking.

RH-89384 is about orthogonal / plan views - i am talking about 3d-Views as well.

@stevebaer you re responsible for the non-Rectangular details ?

thanks for feedback on this topic - kind regards -tom

A very good resource yes but it’s becoming outdated. And I wouldn’t say that the Rhino 7 workflow works for Rhino 8, unless we’re talking about very basic layouts or just the fundamentals. The bugs with the lineweights mean that you usually cannot use the same workflow. In Rhino 8 you have to sidestep all the bugs. After that you can get pretty good results but you really have to hack away at it.

I have different layers for “raster” and “vector” viewports/detail views, plus additional layers for my own unique classifications of views. I set them to different colors and that way I know which one I’m selecting (red for “R”aster, violet for “V”ector). Once I’m good and settled on my system I’m going to whip up some sort of script to streamline things. Right now I will hide the viewport I don’t want to access (would be very easy to create buttons that do this). I find I have to hide the raster viewport sometimes when dimensions don’t snap to the detail view like I expect (vector views tend to be way more reliable).

PrintDisplay is totally buggered. It’s a pain in the ass to have to turn it off and on. I used to always forget to adjust my print colors but I’m getting way better at managing that. The way they’ve done things makes a lot of features half-redundant. It doesn’t help that some view modes still draw on Rhino 7’s legacy features others on 8. Linetypes are buggy. I wish everything was more like Rhino 7 except that we had the section styles.

Good results are possible but it takes too much experimenting. I’m only recently getting really good consistent results but it took a mountain of effort to figure things out.

+1: the thing with consistent linetypes and a proper working printdisplay would be a very good start, to keep frustration at bay - this is especially true when combining rhino8 with visualarq, the trial and error to get everything right is tedious and not straight forward at all. and the feeling that patch after patch stuff gets fixed, but new problems arise is not making me comfortable in trusting a certain workflow works.

best regards,

sebowim