"BIG" BUG toolbars

after a long time I wanted to give try to the WIP again…

I opened my custom toolbar on the left and organized the others as my usual on V7.

when I restart the WIP something moves…

when I perss ESC to go back from _Fullscreen mode this is what i see…

is this a BUG or did I miss something

Rhino 8 SR0 2023-6-20 (Rhino WIP, 8.0.23171.14305, Git hash:master @ b92f7d293d9a041a6f2cbc4ed304f99aba992c88)
License type: Commercial, build 2023-06-20
License details: Cloud Zoo
Expires on: 2023-08-04

Windows 11 (10.0.22621 SR0.0) or greater (Physical RAM: 64Gb)

Computer platform: DESKTOP

Standard graphics configuration.
Primary display and OpenGL: NVIDIA RTX A5000 (NVidia) Memory: 24GB, Driver date: 6-10-2023 (M-D-Y). OpenGL Ver: 4.6.0 NVIDIA 536.25
> Accelerated graphics device with 8 adapter port(s)
- Secondary monitor attached to adapter port 0
- Secondary monitor attached to adapter port 1
- Windows Main Display attached to adapter port #2

Secondary graphics devices.
NVIDIA RTX A5000 (NVidia) Memory: 24GB, Driver date: 6-10-2023 (M-D-Y).
> Accelerated graphics device with 0 adapter port(s)
- There are no monitors attached to this device!

OpenGL Settings
Safe mode: Off
Use accelerated hardware modes: On
Redraw scene when viewports are exposed: On
Graphics level being used: OpenGL 4.6 (primary GPU’s maximum)

Anti-alias mode: 4x
Mip Map Filtering: Linear
Anisotropic Filtering Mode: High

Vendor Name: NVIDIA Corporation
Render version: 4.6
Shading Language: 4.60 NVIDIA
Driver Date: 6-10-2023
Driver Version:
Maximum Texture size: 32768 x 32768
Z-Buffer depth: 24 bits
Maximum Viewport size: 32768 x 32768
Total Video Memory: 24564 MB

Rhino plugins that do not ship with Rhino
C:\ProgramData\McNeel\Rhinoceros\7.0\Plug-ins\Datasmith Rhino Exporter (d1fdc795-b334-4933-b680-088119cdc6bb)\DatasmithRhino7.rhp “Datasmith Exporter”
C:\Users\enzo\AppData\Roaming\McNeel\Rhinoceros\packages\8.0\NVIDIADenoiser\0.4.3\NVIDIADenoiser.Windows.rhp “NVIDIADenoiser.Windows”

Rhino plugins that ship with Rhino
C:\Program Files\Rhino 8 WIP\Plug-ins\Commands.rhp “Commands” 8.0.23171.14305
C:\Program Files\Rhino 8 WIP\Plug-ins\rdk.rhp “Renderer Development Kit”
C:\Program Files\Rhino 8 WIP\Plug-ins\RhinoRenderCycles.rhp “Rhino Render” 8.0.23171.14305
C:\Program Files\Rhino 8 WIP\Plug-ins\rdk_etoui.rhp “RDK_EtoUI” 8.0.23171.14305
C:\Program Files\Rhino 8 WIP\Plug-ins\rdk_ui.rhp “Renderer Development Kit UI”
C:\Program Files\Rhino 8 WIP\Plug-ins\NamedSnapshots.rhp “Snapshots”
C:\Program Files\Rhino 8 WIP\Plug-ins\RhinoCycles.rhp “RhinoCycles” 8.0.23171.14305
C:\Program Files\Rhino 8 WIP\Plug-ins\RhinoCode\RhinoRoslyn.rhp “RhinoRoslyn” 8.0.23171.14305
C:\Program Files\Rhino 8 WIP\Plug-ins\RhinoCode\RhinoCodePlugin.rhp “RhinoCodePlugin” 8.0.23171.14305
C:\Program Files\Rhino 8 WIP\Plug-ins\RhinoCode\RhinoCPython.rhp “RhinoCPython” 8.0.23171.14305
C:\Program Files\Rhino 8 WIP\Plug-ins\Toolbars\Toolbars.rhp “Toolbars” 8.0.23171.14305
C:\Program Files\Rhino 8 WIP\Plug-ins\3dxrhino.rhp “3Dconnexion 3D Mouse”
C:\Program Files\Rhino 8 WIP\Plug-ins\Displacement.rhp “Displacement”
C:\Program Files\Rhino 8 WIP\Plug-ins\SectionTools.rhp “SectionTools”

Hi Enzo -

That looks a lot like RH-70275 Workspaces: Keep size of containers between sessions

looks like I will never use WIP again for a long time…

Then clearly you do not understand the purpose of and your role in the Rhino development process.

The Work-In-Progress builds are made available to license owners for the current shipping version. We give you access to the new, incomplete, and sometimes buggy tools that will be in the next version of Rhino when released. In exchange for this access, we ask that you report problems and thereby extend our development resources resulting in better tools.

Please read this pinned Serengeti post again:

what’s not clear to me @John_Brock is why it takes forever to fix BUGS…

just an example…

So, I don’t see the utility of reporting any feedback if nothing is done…

Can’t work on WIP if tools are going around the screen… can you?
(at the end of the day I have to finish my work otherwise no salary for me)

The developers set the priority on what gets worked on and when.
There is a huge volume or work and a relatively limited number of developers.

Using the WIP release for production work can be risky. That’s for you to decide.
Sometimes the new tools are worth the risk, other times not.
Only you can gauge that.

This issue is under active development:
Have you read the comments and progress?
It is slated to be fixed before initial release.
That’s what “Release Target 8.0” means.

Hi @John_Brock and @JohnM,

i don’t want to apply any pressure here on the particular issue but since it’s been reported since september 2022 and the culprit has been exactly identified by @Gijs and @wim, would it be possible to put this a bit higher on the list ?

I really would like to contribute to this process but since 9 months my weekly routine with the WIP is to open it, rearrange all panels which have not been saved from last use, check for updates, install and open it to see that the issue is still there.

Since the reason for this bug is the comma separator i asume that most users in the european union will suffer from it and probably refrain from doing more in depth WIP testing if they recognize every week that such basic things like toolbars stay in that state for such a long time.

sorry for the rant,

As you can seein https://mcneel.myjetbrains.com/youtrack/issue/RH-70275
One of our remote techs cn repeat this but no one else in tech support or development can.

The YT item is open. We have to understand and reproduce the problem before we can fix it.
No amount of “pressure” or “urgency” will help fix it.

Hi John,

as i wrote above, no pressure from my side. I can reproduce this bug by changing the decimal seperator from a comma to a point in the dialog on the right:

If i use a point instead of a comma, start Rhino 8, arrange my panels, close and reopen Rhino 8, the panel positions are properly remembered. Once i change the decimal seperator back to a comma while Rhino 8 is open, then close and reopen it, the panel positions are not remembered.

Can you reproduce the problem with above description ?


Thank you!
I just added your image, comments, and link back to your post to the YT report.
Hopefully this will be enough for @JohnM to figure it out.


Hi John, great.

btw. I’ve found that if i start Rhino 8 Wip with a power shell script like below:

Set-ItemProperty -Path “HKCU:\Control Panel\International” -Name sDecimal -Value “.”
& “C:\Program Files\Rhino 8 WIP\System\Rhino.exe”
Start-Sleep -Seconds 3
Set-ItemProperty -Path “HKCU:\Control Panel\International” -Name sDecimal -Value “,”

…it remembers my panel positions :nerd_face:

Basically this script changes the decimal seperator to a point, invokes Rhino.exe, waits 3 seconds, then changes it back to a comma. Not sure which impact this has in Rhino yet but i can still enter decimal point coordinate tripples seperated by commas and such with no problem…


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RH-70275 is fixed in the latest WIP

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