Badly inflating file sizes again... ugh

My model is bloating again. In the last month is has fairly steadily grown from 270mb to 660mb. I haven’t added anything significant… Mostly just editing what’s there. Something is obviously going wrong. Any ideas? Here’s the audit3dm info:

Testing 3dm Archive: C:\Users\Ryan\Documents\inuksuk working\x2 nfc 325.3dm
Start Section: 380 bytes (offset 0 to 380)
Offset: 0
3dm archive version: 50
Interface Name: Rhinoceros 5.0 - English Commercial, build 2014-10-15 - (compiled Oct 15 2014)
SDK Version: 201103035.201410155
OpenNURBS Version: 201410155
3dm Version: 5
Operating System: Windows Platform 2 (6.2) build 9200 sp 0.0, suite 768, product type 1
3DM I/O processor: OpenNURBS toolkit version 201410155 (compiled on Oct 7 2014)

Properties Section: 290203 bytes (offset 380 to 290583)
3dm archive openNURBS version: 201410155
Application Information:
Name: "Rhinoceros 5.0"
URL: ""
Details: "English Commercial, build 2014-10-15"
Revision History:
Create Time: Wednesday November 21 16:20:00 2012 UCT
Last Edit Time: Tuesday November 04 21:40:06 2014 UCT
Revision Count: 1307
Created By: "Ryan"
Last Edit By: "Ryan"
Settings Section: 88000 bytes (offset 290583 to 378583)
Name: 3Dconnexion 3D Mouse
Version: 1.1.14289.101
Id: DCA0DB8D-844C-48d6-BA97-F5595FE6AFDB
File: C:\Program Files\Rhinoceros 5.0 (64-bit)\Plug-ins\3dxrhino.rhp
SDK Version: C++ 201103035.201410155
Name: Alerter
Version: Oct 15 2014 12:08:05
Id: 7D2A9297-A74A-4218-8F3A-6610CDCF8DFB
File: C:\Program Files\Rhinoceros 5.0 (64-bit)\Plug-ins\Alerter.rhp
SDK Version: C++ 201103035.201410155
Name: AnimationTools
Version: Oct 15 2014 12:08:09
Id: 3AA81848-5635-41bb-ABDB-0EC069BC5519
File: C:\Program Files\Rhinoceros 5.0 (64-bit)\Plug-ins\AnimationTools.rhp
SDK Version: C++ 201103035.201410155
Name: IdleProcessor
Version: Oct 15 2014 12:11:33
Id: 3B2D8652-2A2A-49c7-99EF-9EBC5B7B3B96
File: C:\Program Files\Rhinoceros 5.0 (64-bit)\Plug-ins\IdleProcessor.rhp
SDK Version: C++ 201103035.201410155
Name: LicenseOptions
Version: 1.0.5401.30745
Id: E3B81849-2819-4ad2-8440-F8D93ECE995E
File: C:\Program Files\Rhinoceros 5.0 (64-bit)\Plug-ins\LicenseOptions.rhp
SDK Version: .NET 201103035.201410155
Name: Maxwell for Rhino
Id: 491AC9CC-69C8-4369-AB68-019A44F49DDC
File: C:\Program Files (x86)\MaxwellDotNET\Maxwell.Rhino\Maxwell.Rhino.rhp
SDK Version: .NET 201103035.201410155
Name: Named Position
Version: Oct 15 2014 12:14:22
Id: FCEA57AE-7C24-4bc5-A067-1DFFA6139859
File: C:\Program Files\Rhinoceros 5.0 (64-bit)\Plug-ins\NamedPositions.rhp
SDK Version: C++ 201103035.201410155
Name: Orca3D
Version: 1.4 WIP (2014-08-05 06:01:16)
Id: 8B62C204-C421-4422-BE79-085DDF05F02B
File: C:\Program Files\Orca3D (64-bit)\Mistral.dll
SDK Version: .NET 201103035.201410155
Name: Renderer Development Kit
Version: Oct 15 2014 17:51:45
Id: 16592D58-4A2F-401d-BF5E-3B87741C1B1B
File: C:\Program Files\Rhinoceros 5.0 (64-bit)\Plug-ins\rdk.rhp
SDK Version: C++ 201103035.201410155
Name: Rhino Bonus Tools
Version: Oct 15 2014 12:15:24
Id: 213A2661-A9EC-4ac4-867A-BC8CABE5AE29
File: C:\Program Files\Rhinoceros 5.0 (64-bit)\Plug-ins\RhinoBonusTools.rhp
SDK Version: C++ 201103035.201410155
Name: Rhino Render
Version: 1.50, Oct 15 2014, 12:07:02
Id: 5DC0192D-73DC-44f5-9141-8E72542E792D
File: C:\Program Files\Rhinoceros 5.0 (64-bit)\Plug-ins\RhinoRender.rhp
SDK Version: C++ 201103035.201410155
Name: Rhino Toolbars and Menus
Version: 5.0.5401.30748
Id: DC297053-96C0-4883-A688-8326B4E024A8
File: C:\Program Files\Rhinoceros 5.0 (64-bit)\Plug-ins\Toolbars\Toolbars.rhp
SDK Version: .NET 201103035.201410155
Name: RhinoScript
Version: Oct 15 2014 12:02:07
Id: 1C7A3523-9A8F-4cec-A8E0-310F580536A7
File: C:\Program Files\Rhinoceros 5.0 (64-bit)\Plug-ins\RhinoScript.rhp
SDK Version: C++ 201103035.201410155
Name: SectionTools
Version: Apr 2 2012 18:44:22
Id: FBDB1D7F-8CFB-42c1-9858-87CB6315932C
File: C:\Users\Ryan\AppData\Roaming\McNeel\Rhinoceros\5.0\Plug-ins\SectionTools {6531A814-B093-418B-846F-3F0925187719}\2012.4.2.1129\Win64\SectionTools.rhp
SDK Version: C++ 201103035.201203135
Name: WebBrowser
Version: Oct 15 2014 12:16:19
Id: 12D31EFD-D3EE-4bcf-A856-D01320BB19F3
File: C:\Program Files\Rhinoceros 5.0 (64-bit)\Plug-ins\WebBrowser.rhp
SDK Version: C++ 201103035.201410155
Bitmap Table:
bitmap[0]: \psf\Home\Desktop\hood 1 ton plan.tif
bitmap[1]: \psf\Home\Desktop\hood 1 ton profile.tif
bitmap[2]: C:\Users\Ryan\Downloads\Modern-Coffee-table\Metal_Aluminum_Anodized.jpg
3 bitmaps, 3728748 bytes (offset 378583 to 4107331)
Texture Mapping Table:

55 texture mappings, 24499 bytes (offset 4107331 to 4131830)
Material Table:
material[0]: Bronze Polished
material[1]: Pure-Matte
material[2]: SS polished
material[3]: smooth Black Matte Finish
material[4]: Glossy White Paint
material[5]: Grey plastic
material[6]: Aluminum- Anodized Blue- Light
material[7]: Black Glossy

material[761]: downpipe eyeball assy.3dm : Powdercoat to match MDC Tiresias Bone
762 materials with 255 plug-in data items, 610955 bytes (offset 4131830 to 4742785)
Linetype Table:
linetype[0]: Hidden
linetype[1]: Dashed
linetype[2]: DashDot
linetype[3]: Center
linetype[4]: Border
linetype[5]: Dots
linetype[6]: HIDDEN2
linetype[7]: STYLE_06

linetype[21]: CENTERX2
22 linetypes, 4514 bytes (offset 4742785 to 4747299)
Layer Table:
layer[0]: construction grid
layer[1]: figure
layer[2]: screenshot waterplane
layer[3]: structure - hull and deck
layer[4]: structure - house
layer[5]: grey water great room
layer[6]: ///// interior /////
layer[7]: great room

layer[551]: engine box working temp
552 layers, 140910 bytes (offset 4747299 to 4888209)
Group Table:
group[0]: Group1141
group[1]: Group1320
group[2]: Group1355
group[3]: Group1357
group[4]: Group1358
group[5]: Group1359
group[6]: Group1445
group[7]: Group1447
group[537]: Group4365
538 groups, 71562 bytes (offset 4888209 to 4959771)
Font Table:
font[0]: Font 01
font[1]: Arial
font[2]: Century Gothic
font[3]: Default
font[4]: Stylus BT
font[5]: Palatino Linotype
font[6]: structure model 022.3dm : Arial
font[7]: structure model 022.3dm : Palatino Linotype

font[9]: nav light - bow and stern.3dm : Default
10 fonts, 2990 bytes (offset 4959771 to 4962761)
DimStyle Table:
dimstyle[0]: Default
dimstyle[1]: Millimeter Architectural
dimstyle[2]: Millimeter Large
dimstyle[3]: Millimeter Small
dimstyle[4]: Wynott
dimstyle[5]: Dimension Style 01
dimstyle[6]: MF Circa
dimstyle[7]: SLDDIMSTYLE0

dimstyle[41]: MF Circa III
42 dimstyles with 41 plug-in data items, 30051 bytes (offset 4962761 to 4992812)
Light Table:
0 lights, 24 bytes (offset 4992812 to 4992836)
HatchPattern Table:
hatchpattern[0]: Solid
hatchpattern[1]: Hatch1
hatchpattern[2]: Hatch2
hatchpattern[3]: Hatch3
hatchpattern[4]: HatchDash
hatchpattern[5]: Grid
hatchpattern[6]: Grid60
hatchpattern[7]: Plus

hatchpattern[26]: ANSI34
27 hatchpatterns, 7080 bytes (offset 4992836 to 4999916)
InstanceDefinition Table:
instance definition[0]: stanchion
instance definition[1]: pushpit
instance definition[2]: gate
instance definition[3]: pulpit
instance definition[4]: stabilizer actuator and fin assembly
instance definition[5]: chain stopper
instance definition[6]: inverter
instance definition[7]: eyeball airconcepts

instance definition[261]: engine raw water barb and impeller cover plate
262 instance definitions with 431 plug-in data items, 911617 bytes (offset 4999916 to 5911533)
Object Table:

37852 objects with 2554 plug-in data items, 653491480 bytes (offset 5911533 to 659403013)
History Record Table:
history[0]: 1 antecedents, 1 descendants
1 history records, 1213 bytes (offset 659403013 to 659404226)
Model User Data Table:
user table[0]: (3899 bytes)
Plug-in id: 06F3218E-F5EC-4f6c-B74C-14583F0ED7BC
user table[1]: (3738 bytes)
Plug-in name: Renderer Development Kit
Plug-in id: 16592D58-4A2F-401d-BF5E-3B87741C1B1B
user table[2]: (594388 bytes)
Plug-in name: Rhino Bonus Tools
Plug-in id: 213A2661-A9EC-4ac4-867A-BC8CABE5AE29
user table[3]: (913 bytes)
Plug-in name: AnimationTools
Plug-in id: 3AA81848-5635-41bb-ABDB-0EC069BC5519
user table[4]: (14191993 bytes)
Plug-in name: Maxwell for Rhino
Plug-in id: 491AC9CC-69C8-4369-AB68-019A44F49DDC
user table[5]: (497 bytes)
Plug-in name: Rhino Render
Plug-in id: 5DC0192D-73DC-44f5-9141-8E72542E792D
user table[6]: (69523 bytes)
Plug-in name: Orca3D
Plug-in id: 8B62C204-C421-4422-BE79-085DDF05F02B
user table[7]: (16147 bytes)
Plug-in name: SectionTools
Plug-in id: FBDB1D7F-8CFB-42c1-9858-87CB6315932C
user table[8]: (28 bytes)
Plug-in id: 53F8190B-4E66-4823-95EF-05E8F3F80F56
user table[9]: (9587 bytes)
Plug-in id: 8008880F-8D13-4b2d-92B0-727E12878A4C
10 user tables, 14891723 bytes (offset 659404226 to 674295949)
Archive size = 674295969 bytes (end mark size = 674295969)

It looks like the majority of the file is in a history record. Do you have history turned on? Are you actively using history?

Seems like the “heavy” parts all have plug-in data attached… Maybe I’m reading it wrong though… --Mitch

Yes, I see, you mean this?

Plug-in data is taking up 653 MB?

Do you have Vray? I see Maxwell is carrying a heavy load, but that is to be expected.

I wonder if the problem is the use of Groups? Are you using Groups to collect objects together? Blocks can make user data more efficient. This can be especially true if each material comes with a bitmap.

What render engines are you using?

Hi Ryan - I see this-

37852 objects with 2554 plug-in data items, 653491480 bytes (offset 5911533 to 659403013)

I suspect Maxwell, off hand. If you save a copy using -SaveAs and SavePluginData=No, what is the file size?


No to my knowledge… ? If it is I’m not using it.

Is this different from record history? (for making pipes follow changing curves, etc.) I rarely use it, if ever.

I read the table like maxwell is using 14ish megabytes which seems reasonable. maxwell doesn’t embed any bitmaps, just text.

The filesize actually went up to 693 mb when i did -saveas no plugin data

It’s 642mb with savesmall=yes and saveplugindata=no

maxwell is the only renderer.

Is there a STEP file that was imported. Typically this might be an engine model from a vendor?

I have a bunch of imported models that were originally STEP files, but I’ve saved them all out as 3dm and imported the 3dm.

It seems to me the last time I heard about something similar, and it has been a while - (was it you, Ryan, do you recall having this problem before?) the bitmap table was being overpopulated but that does not seem to be the case here.


Yes I’ve had this problem a few times.

Once, testpurgebitmaptable fixed it…

Once, for some reason flamingo NXT started embedding all my textures for some reason and I didn’t notice, so it was a case of just changing the bitmap mode to linked or whatever.

The last time actually turned out to be a bug in Maxwell that they’ve since corrected.

This seems entirely different to me…

Can you ZIP the file up and send it to us? I think this form will be able to take a file that is large enough:

Waiting on permission to do this.

Hi, my 2cents worth would be to use block manager and switch on SHOW HIDDEN BLOCK DEFINITIONS and check for duplicate definitions of blocks that you may have exploded in the model for editing, yet the block is still in the file even if you’re not using it anymore.
The normal Purge command has an option for blocks, but still worth checking this.
I’ve been sent huge files which only had some simple geometry, eg. where a motor had been defined as a block definition, exploded or removed from the model, but the block definition defining the motor was still in the model file, so it was the same as having it present in the model as far as file size goes. Michael VS

Thanks Michael… No hidden block definitions though unfortunately.

I did discover File Utilities > Purge Unused Information and that got me down to 435 mb but I still feel like the proper file size should be around 250/270ish.

Hi @wynott , Depending on the model size/ram you can also try a quick test of doing a select all on the model you are working on, Copy to Clipboard, New File, and Paste it back into a ‘clean’ file, then save and see what you get for a file size.
If model is too big or ram is too limited for single operation then just open 2 x Rhino sessions and copy/paste from the current file to the fresh one in batches until all copied over, and then save the duplicate and see if that gets rid of baggage in the current file. Michael VS

Hi All… I figured this out.

It has to do with how Maxwell render deals with referenced geometry (MXS reference point clouds). It’s storing this information as embedded blocks. Therefore it doesn’t show up as plugin data.

Many thanks for your ideas.