Hi,
sRGB has been for years pretty much…well, a standard. However, it seems like wide gamut is going increasingly mainstream in monitors, at least as far as DCI-P3 goes, (Apple is already supporting it), Rec. 2020 is further down the road. HDR is also ever more present even in a mid-range monitors (although mostly only HDR400 and HDR600 for now). That could be quite helpful also in CAD to emphasize specific lines, along with architectural renderings). Web browsers are already increasingly supporting ICC profiles…
Are there any plans or considerations to include wide gamut and HDR support in Rhino in the future?
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Hi Rok,
Can you describe problems that you currently encounter in Rhino that you think would be solved by adding support for wide gamut or HDR color spaces?
Well, it’s just a sign of the time, really and I don’t think it can be ignored…sRGB is very a limited color space (some call it “suckRGB”)…sooner or later everybody will jump on it, it’s just a matter of few years…Renderings could be more vibrant, colors more nuanced…specially since renederings are getting more “photo real”…not all colors I cane use in real life can be covered in sRGB… wider range of colors could benefit also productivity in CAD because of better overview…
We tend not to jump onto the newest technology just because it’s new - there are lots of shiny new things out there that can distract us from helping our customers get real work done. Once these color spaces become commonplace, they’ll likely be really easy to support - until then, it’ll take us a lot of effort. So, without a problem to solve, there’s nothing here for us to do, really.
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For Raytraced and the future Rhino Render based on the same Cycles engine (as Blender 3d) I am planning to support the so-called Filmic color management - but that’ll be during WIP v7.
Actually, for a content creator, a limited color space that cannot fully reflect reality is a problem by a definition. sRGB is a just a rather bad compromise, that we are forced to deal with…
Thanks, Nathan, that will be great…do you have any roadmap or timeline for that?
Not really atm, just that I’d like to do it during the WIP for v7. Rhino Mac v6 is currently taking time, but once my main tasks are done I can work towards more features like this.
Just as a refresher for those interested, Filmic is for instance explained here Filmic Color Management in Blender | HDR Tutorial (4/7) • Creative Shrimp
I agree that it is a problem. But it’s an abstract problem. Similar problems exist when people take photographs using film (or even their phone); similarly when people turn ideas into words; when we represent 3D space using double-precision floating point arithmetic; I daresay when people use their senses, they form an imperfect representation of reality. Color spaces are no different. I understand that wide gamut and HDR color spaces can represent a broader range of colors and brightnesses. But I don’t understand how not having it affects your use of Rhino (aside from rendered output). I’m looking for a concrete problem to solve, not an abstract one.
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Well, we’re getting a bit philosophical here: but in the nutshell, for a creative, every unsatisfactory representation is very much a concrete, not merely an abstract problem. The question only is, how severe it is.
If I can’t show a specific color, that’s a problem I have to overcome with other means (explanation, a material sample, etc)…also some details might get lost. That’s as well a presentation as a workflow problem (using a “raytraced” option). And as already pointed out, wider gamut is always beneficial in workflow, in complex models with a lot of layers thinks can get very confusing very quickly. Wider color options would be much appreciated here.
On the other hand, you could see everything as abstract problem: I could also still draw all the plans “old school” and make the models. Or just use AutoCad and stick to 2D. Building would get built also that way. But I rather use a 3D modeler and make a photo-real rendering for a number of reasons. It’s so much easier to see upfront what the result will be like, not to mention a communication with a costumer. Even if their monitor doesn’t support wide gamut, I could still show them that on my laptop or tablet. So, tell me, where does a solving a problem ends and improving starts. It’s a very blurred line.
But for you, the most important argument is market. In a year or so, sRGB will start to fade out as standard. Web browsers have already reacted, Apple has already gone wide gamut, other brands are following suit, pushing it into mainstream…
And if hardware is there, we, creatives will want to use in entire workflow…it’s simple as that…
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Filmic color management in Rhino 7 ?
There’s three filmic tone mappings you can choose in the post effects section of the render window.
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Which one is closer to ACES?
That I do not know, sorry.
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