Rhino 7 Subdivision Workflow suggestions

[jack.meyer]

Hey All:

I’ve finally have time to explore Rhino 7 WIP’s new subdivision tools. I’m loving what I see so far. So much promise!

It seems to me the important thing for this tool-set is to get the interface and workflow right. Subdivision modelling is a pretty mature area of development in the CAD industry by now, and there are a lot of interface conventions people have come to expect. At the very least, we should be conceding to the best of these. Similarly, we have an opportunity to learn from the mistakes of our predecessors T-Splines and (especially) Clayoo.

In the spirit of this, I’d like to offer some subdivision workflow and interface suggestions. I’m sure there will be some who don’t agree with me here, or who think “who does he think he is?”, but I’m also sure I’m not the only person who’s thought of these:

1.) Using ALT + Drag as a shortcut for extrude has been so common across so many different subdivision interfaces, it feels weird to have it absent from Rhino 7 subdivision. Can we add this in please?

2.) Similarly, could ALT+Gumball Scale be made into a shortcut for the “Inset Subd Edges” command? Both this and the first one were highly useful in other programs, and would save a lot of modelling time.

3.) I know there’s a SubD panel. But, like with all the other commands, perhaps it might be worthwhile having a couple of dedicated tool buttons for subdivision commands. Perhaps break up all the creation commands into one section, and all the editing into another?

4.) You know how you can double-click to select an edge loop? What if you added an ALT+click to Edge Ring select?

5.) Can we make bridge also usable faces, not just edges? This is how it works in many other subdivision modellers.

6.) I notice we have quite a nice Subd Loft command. Could we also have a set of Subd 1 and 2 Rail Sweep commands please?

7.) Do we have any kind of retopology snap which allows us to draw appended subd faces directly onto other objects? Perhaps it could be added directly to the Append to Subd command?

8.) For Fill Subd Hole, I notice we have different closure types. Could we have a preview option?

9.) I’ve tried using Splop and Orient On Surface (and other surface application commands) on subd surfaces. However, they only allow users to apply objects one face at a time. Is there a way we could make a selection filter or something similar which allows users to use the whole object?

Thank you for listening.

Regards,

Jack Meyer
www.cadjewelleryskills.com

[rhinofan]

Yes, IMHO there is room for improvement on the SubD interface. I suggested a revised gumball in another post, to avoid having to play with a complicated sequence of computer keys . Notice that you can already bridge faces

[jack.meyer]

Really? How can you bridge faces? It wouldn’t let me when I tried this morning…

[inju]

@jack.meyer

1.) Using ALT + Drag as

@jack.meyer

2.) Similarly, could ALT+Gumball Scale be made into a shortcut for the “Inset Subd Edges” command?

@jack.meyer

5.) Can we make bridge also usable faces, not just edges?

[inju]

@jack.meyer

7.) Do we have any kind of retopology snap which allows us to draw appended subd faces directly onto other objects? Perhaps it could be added directly to the Append to Subd command?

_ Append - command
_QuadRemesh

[theoutside (Kyle Houchens)]

@jack.meyer

1.) Using ALT + Drag as a shortcut for extrude has been so common across so many different subdivision interfaces, it feels weird to have it absent from Rhino 7 subdivision. Can we add this in please?

Ctrl+drag is the key command to extrude in rhino-

2.) Similarly, could ALT+Gumball Scale be made into a shortcut for the “Inset Subd Edges” command? Both this and the first one were highly useful in other programs, and would save a lot of modelling time.

ctrl+scale will extrude, you can use this to inset.

3.) I know there’s a SubD panel. But, like with all the other commands, perhaps it might be worthwhile having a couple of dedicated tool buttons for subdivision commands. Perhaps break up all the creation commands into one section, and all the editing into another?
if you don’t have the subd toolbar- run toolbarreset and restart rhino to get it.

4.) You know how you can double-click to select an edge loop? What if you added an ALT+click to Edge Ring select?

there is a command for edge loop and ring select you can hotkey it as needed.

5.) Can we make bridge also usable faces, not just edges? This is how it works in many other subdivision modellers.

it works on faces in rhino-

6.) I notice we have quite a nice Subd Loft command. Could we also have a set of Subd 1 and 2 Rail Sweep commands please?

we do- there is a subd output option for both

7.) Do we have any kind of retopology snap which allows us to draw appended subd faces directly onto other objects? Perhaps it could be added directly to the Append to Subd command?

you can snap to a mesh

8.) For Fill Subd Hole, I notice we have different closure types. Could we have a preview option?

good suggestion!

9.) I’ve tried using Splop and Orient On Surface (and other surface application commands) on subd surfaces. However, they only allow users to apply objects one face at a time. Is there a way we could make a selection filter or something similar which allows users to use the whole object?

you can absolutely use the whole object-

[jack.meyer]

Thank you guys for taking the time to answer my questions.

I’ll try these out and get back to you.

[jack.meyer]

Hi there:

In your first video, what button are you holding down for the Extrude? Neither Ctrl nor Alt seem to work on my version (latest Rhino 7 WIP).

[jack.meyer]

Hello:

Thank you for the full list here. However, I’ve tried Ctrl+Drag, and Alt+Drag. But it seems Control+Drag does nothing with Gumball except move the gumball. Alt+Drag just drags off and makes a copy of that individual face.

I’ve downloaded the latest Rhino 7 WIP. Still no change.

Am I missing something?

[theoutside (Kyle Houchens)]

drag then ctrl-

or use the extrude dot.

[jack.meyer]

Thank you. That seems to work.

The missing piece of the puzzle was you have to really hold down the Ctrl key for a full second.

[Jonathan_Hutchinson (Jonathan)]

@jack.meyer

9.) I’ve tried using Splop and Orient On Surface (and other surface application commands) on subd surfaces. However, they only allow users to apply objects one face at a time.

Yep. This makes a lot of great rhino tools a bit redundant to combine with SubD. What we need is for these tools to use, for example, a single surface behind the scenes that is as dense as required to be accurate, so that we can use stuff like Splop. Imagine a case of designing a shoe upper as a subd. You’re going to need more than a single edge loop to describe that upper. You couldn’t then add, for example, an appliqued logo (N for New balance?) and deform it on the SubD. That’s a big thing missing IMO. I’m sure something would be do able with even just the some render mesh normals being used to gradually deform something across many edge loops of a subd. until then, SoftTransform is our only friend.

[theoutside (Kyle Houchens)]

have you tried projecting a sub ont another piece of geometry?

check this- https://youtu.be/VSN3u2PgELk

[Jonathan_Hutchinson (Jonathan)]

Ah, yes! This was a nice trick. But, it would be an object with height, that I would project (like flowing a cube or sphere - you wouldn’t want to just flatten / squash that sphere, you’d want the 3D object formed to the contour.

One that would be well worth some thought, I think.