I press the Tab key in Rhino 8 BETA, yet the number will not invert from positive to negative, or vice versa. Instead, Tab acts is if I hit the Enter key instead. Totally counter-intuitive and missed opportunity to make movement of objects this way with Gumball much more convenient.
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I would like to propose a much needed feature for the Gumball, which will make it considerably more useful. The user must be able to toggle between âSnappy draggingâ and âSmooth draggingâ with the Tab key while dragging some of the Gumball handles to move, scale or rotate the selected object(s). That way, the behaviour of the Gumball could be changed on the fly at any time if needed.
As an alternative, hovering the mouse pointer (without clicking) over some of the Gumball handles for move, rotate or scale for more than a certain period of time (must be user-defined in milliseconds) will automatically toggle to the other mode after the left mouse button is being pressed to activate the handle. For example, if I choose âSmooth draggingâ to be my default mode for Gumball, hovering the mouse pointer over some of the Gumball handles for more than 2 seconds will temporarily switch to âSnappy draggingâ and let me take advantage of it for the current modification. Once I release the handle, the Gumball reverts to âSmooth draggingâ.
That function should come with a visual indication, too. It may be a mouse tooltip that shows up after hovering the mouse pointer on some of the Gumball handles (just like it already does in Rhino 8).
A third alternative is to use the right mouse button as a swap behaviour. For example, if I use the Gumball handles with the left mouse button while âSmooth draggingâ is set as the default mode, then dragging the same handle with the right mouse button will use the âSnappy draggingâ instead. One potential disadvantage in this case is that the user will no longer be able to move, rotate or scale the object while also manipulate the camera at the same moment via the right mouse button. This is why it could be an option that the user will be able to turn on or off from the Gumballâs settings. To overcome that disadvantage, the toggle between the two dragging modes could be done via a single press with the right mouse button, so that the camera manipulation will be still available afterwards. 
A fourth alternative is to add a new handle next to the Gumball to quickly switch between the âSnappy draggingâ and âSmooth draggingâ modes. It must provide two modes in the Gumballâs settings: either work as a permanent toggle (unless pressed again) or as a single-click toggle that reverts to the previous mode afterwards. This could be done also based on whether the handle was pressed with the left mouse button or the right mouse button, as shown in the image below. No need to reach any keys, settings and sub-menus.
If the âMcNeelâ team could provide the 4 options listed above, that will be a huge win for the Rhino users.
NOTE: Iâm aware that I can assign a key to run the following macro _GumballSettings _SnappyGumball _Enter, but it does not work while I drag a Gumball handle. This is a dealbreaker to me, not to mention that there is no way to swap between âSnappy draggingâ and âSmooth draggingâ without pressing any key, which is a real inconvenience for those who use a 3d mouse.
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I like your idea - first option of hitting tab to toggle snappy dragging sounds like the best one.
I also like my idea of using the SHIFT key when clicking the gumball (move, scale, rotate etc.) to INVERT the value in the numerical entry box. Its so simple yet save a lot of people a lot of time!
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I really hope that the proposition to switch between swap between âSnappy draggingâ and âSmooth draggingâ will be taken seriously by the developers and they will implement it in Rhino 9.
Also, a convenient way to switch between positive and negative number in the dialog box when moving by double-clicking Gumballâs arrow.
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Yeah, I canât tell you how many times a day I start moving something with gumball and realize that snappy drag is turned off (but leaving it on is unworkable for me.) Iâd be happy with your first three options (not so much #4 - I donât think the gumball needs another handle.) Also, as Ben_B wrote, inverting the value in the dialog would be super useful for me.
Maybe Iâm missing something, but whatâs wrong with holding ALT while gumball-dragging to temporarily toggle between snappy and smooth dragging? (ALT must be pressed after the dragging started, otherwise itâs copy).
I believe that the answer to this question was already given in the topic, but I will write it here, too.
First of all, working with Smooth dragging will not let you use Alt as a modifier to switch to Snappy dragging (it works only the other way around). As I work with Smooth dragging most of the time, pressing the Alt key will do nothing for me.
Not to mention that when I hold the alt key to switch from Snappy dragging to Smooth dragging, Rhino will instantly move the selection in an unnatural way, because the origin of the Gumball will jump to where the arrow was pressed initially. This is really disturbing when moving b a small distance.
Secondly, I use a 3d mouse with my left hand, meaning that even if it was possible to use Alt as a modifier to temporarily switch Snappy dragging, I would be forced to leave the 3d mouse to press the Alt key each time I want to switch between the two modes of Gumball. My proposal to use the alternative dragging by clicking and holding the mouse pointer with the right mouse button (or, alternatively, hover the mouse pointer for 3 seconds on the arrow BEFORE dragging it with the left mouse button) easily solves that problem. However, at the moment this is not implemented and is a missed opportunity to make the use of Gumball much more convenient.
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Thanks for the explanation!
Youâre right! I would have expected it to do so, but since my Gumball is always set to âsnappyâ, I never noticed. It should work the other way around, too.
Right, again. It obviously does this to align the Gumball with the cursor as a first step, so the cursor can find the snap target without having an offset to the Gumball (I remember 3ds Max having a similar issue, and some feature for it). Might feel âunnaturalâ, but it has a purpose.
When click-holding a Gumball arrow, the holding ALT, this behavior is unnecessary, actually. It should feel exactly like when smooth dragging was on.
Ok, I never used one. Does not have any modifier keys on it, does it.
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I use Space Pilot, which has its own Alt key, but itâs inconvenient to reach that particular key. Also, as I mentioned above, I set my Gumball to use âSmooth draggingâ by default, so even if I hold the Alt key itâs impossible to activate the âSnappy draggingâ with it. Hence my request for implementing 3 alternative ways to switch between both modes via the mouse alone:
- Press a tiny icon next to the Gumball. Note that this option has the advantage to activate one-time switch of the dragging mode, then it reverts to the previous mode (similar to how OSnap could be activated for a one-time use). Check the bottom of my image below;
- Hover over the arrow handle for 3 seconds, then drag with the LMB;
- Drag with the RMB.
The third option seems to be the easiest to implement, and most logical, because it will activate the opposite mode compared to the one currently used by the LMB. For example, if âSmooth draggingâ is assigned to the LMB, the RMB activates the âSnappy draggingâ. And vice versa.
What if I add a command line option while dragging that lets you swap between snappy and smooth dragging? Something like this:
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I havnât read the whole thread, so forgive me if I repeat something said earlier:
I think swithing between smooth and snappy via a modifier key while dragging would be the best solution. This would free keys already in use when not dragging. Maybe the tab key?
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This would also have to work when draggin a plane with the plane button.
With Smart Track on, TAB can be used to lock a distance and dragging is constrained to a circle.
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I agree a key tap would be best but the all the modifier keys are spoken for. CTRL does extrude. ALT enables/disables OSnaps and will copy on tap. Shift is ortho mode or both sides when extruding. Tab does tab mode or switches between smooth and flat mode for SubD. The taps/holding a key before or after the click to do relocate or whatever is something we really tried to get away from for Rhino 8. Itâs tough to learn and teach finger jiujitsu.
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Yeah, you are probably right.
I didnât think of the tab key being used for smooth/flat in subD as I was conditioned to use the toggle icon from the SubD beginnings in the version 7 wip (back in the day when âflatâ used to be called âcrunchyâ). The tab key came later iirc
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What about using 2 modifiers together? A relativly common practice in other apps âŚ
Is there any combination that is free? [Canât immediately thinks of all the possible existing use case]
But even more important is a visual cue of which mode GB is in! color change, or a symbol showing the mode, as requested by @Rhino_Bulgaria.
Command line is ok, but one can also use Aliases to change, But the focus for the eyes is GB, So the status information needs to be in it.
Please.
thanks a lot
Akash
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Is best to avoid the use of a key and instead make it possible to switch between the two modes only with the mouse. One if my proposals does that by simply hovering the mouse pointer over the arrow handle for a certain amount of time before the actual dragging. Another way is to click on a nearby icon, which also serves as an indicator to show which dragging mice is active.
- How about the gumball arrow âshaftsâ having 2 âsectionâ, with a slightly different color, for smooth and snappy?
- Or drag the tip for snappy and theâshaft for smooth?
Ok, that might not work well because since R8 the gumball is populated with some more handles like for quick booleans etc. How would you mix both âmodesâ?
Not ideal, because itâs an extra click (each one counts for a nice workflow).
That would need to be a rather short timespan, like 0,3s or something. You mentioned 3s, which is half an eternity when you are in the middle of something.
But based on this idea: Just roll over the arrow tips, and after a brief moment, or even instantaneously?, they toggle their color (or shape?) slightly, indicating the drag mode.
Have to chime in and strongly agree here - UI elements that depend on hard-coded delays and variables based on user action time-outs inevitably reduce agility and result in terrible usability. Particularly for anything that likely happens in a repeated fashion, such as a basic transformation in a modeling tool. It also presumes a degree of neurological typicality with regard to reflex and action timing control, something that varies widely across ages etc.
Rhino has several options that include adjustable time intervals in milliseconds (cursor tooltips, too). In case that you prefer to hover the mouse pointer for just one second, then just set 1000 ms and you are done.
Also, keep in mind that the proposal is regarding switching the dragging mode to the secondary one. For example, if you set âSmooth draggingâ to be the mode you want to be primary, then you will need to hover the mouse pointer over the arrow handle only in those rare cases where you want to use âSnappy draggingâ instead. And vice versa.
Lastly, trust me, having to leave the 3d mouse to reach some key on the keyboard is far more frustrating and takes no less time. Not to mention that you lose the ability to manipulate the camera meanwhile.
Even if that sounds too slow for some people, then my other proposal to assign âSmooth draggingâ to the LMB and âSnappy draggingâ to the RMB is the best possible solution.
Ehm⌠Iâm using Snappy all the time and handle 6 hrs of modelling with RMB would give me hand pain before even finish the day. No, this is not a viable solution.
I understand your proposal but it should be a combination of keys.
Eventually we can have an extra âbutton/iconâ on each arrow⌠But it may results in a confusing solution, especially for beginners.