I have been trying to render an interior scene for some time. It does not work. The results are always different than expected (I have experience with lighting from other 3D programs). If a light comes from behind and I add one from the front, the light from behind is no longer visible. Stranger still, in places the scene becomes darker with more light sources. Shadows also work incorrectly. If I lower the shadow, the light becomes darker. no shadow no light. This may be true in reality, but virtually this behavior is completely unusable.
Well, since everything didn’t look good, I transferred the light sources from the scene to an example scene with two cubes to understand what the light is doing there. This produces results that I can’t do anything with. This is not reality.
Picture one: Where does the light come from?
Picture two: One light casts shadows of two?
Picture three: Two lights, nothing changes in the shadows?
Picture four: Three lights, a shadow is cast twice at the front?
Picture five: The shadow falls towards the light?
Picture five: How four but shadows are switched off…
I’ll stop here, Rhino is unusable for me in this state!
*** Translated with DeepL Translate: The world's most accurate translator (free version) ***
It’s hard to tell what exactly is happening. Have you got a 3dm file anyone can see with a minimal working version of the problem?
Yes. Exactly the scene from my examples.
Renderingproblem.3dm (64.8 KB)
Hi @Dietrich_Frank,
What lighting method have you set here (Scene lightning is default) ?
Note that if you change it, it does not update unless you end Raytraced display and switch it back on. Some general suggestions to handle these situations:
- Give the groundplane a material instead of using constant white
- For the background, make the environment visible instead of solid color
- Start with one light and isolate it from the Lights panel
- Assign a color to each of your lights
- Avoid insanely high intensities to limit bleeding
- Make sure the shadow intensity is at 100%
- Make sure your material is not constant
- Enable Lights for Raytraced in the Display panel so you see what you edit
- Alternatively assign some names to your lights to avoid confusion
- Avoid using fully horizontal distant light (no shadow on floor)
Any better ? If not please run the command _SystemInfo and post the outcome.
thanks,
c.
Many thanks for the feedback. By the way, I post the system info here all the time…It gets a bit tiring.
Have you tried anything on my scene yourself? By the way, I need white light. nevertheless, I tried it once. The layer now has the default material.
Image 1: I have set “no Lighting”. All lights max 100% Is that perhaps already too much for Rhino?
Picture 2: Shadows are going in the wrong direction. Light is coming from the right, shadows are as if the light is coming from the left.
Picture 3: Two lights, hardly any change in the shadows
Picture 4: Yellow illuminated shadows?
Renderingproblem_2.3dm (61.4 KB)
I am very! dissatisfied!
*** Translated with DeepL Translate: The world's most accurate translator (free version) ***
Rhino 8 SR16 2024-12-30 (Rhino 8, 8.16.24365.02001, Git hash:master @ 53a751178efd1a931ad72ff4c6af9d26be01d19b)
License type: Commercial, Build 2024-12-30
License details: Stand-Alone
Windows 11 (10.0.22631 SR0.0) or greater (Physical RAM: 64GB)
.NET 7.0.0
Computer platform: DESKTOP
Standard graphics configuration.
Primary display and OpenGL: NVIDIA GeForce RTX 3060 (NVidia) Memory: 12GB, Driver date: 12-3-2024 (M-D-Y). OpenGL Ver: 4.6.0 NVIDIA 566.36
> Accelerated graphics device with 4 adapter port(s)
- Windows Main Display attached to adapter port #0
OpenGL Settings
Safe mode: Off
Use accelerated hardware modes: On
GPU Tessellation is: On
Redraw scene when viewports are exposed: On
Graphics level being used: OpenGL 4.6 (primary GPU’s maximum)
Anti-alias mode: 4x
Mip Map Filtering: Linear
Anisotropic Filtering Mode: High
Vendor Name: NVIDIA Corporation
Render version: 4.6
Shading Language: 4.60 NVIDIA
Driver Date: 12-3-2024
Driver Version: 32.0.15.6636
Maximum Texture size: 32768 x 32768
Z-Buffer depth: 24 bits
Maximum Viewport size: 32768 x 32768
Total Video Memory: 12 GB
Rhino plugins that do not ship with Rhino
Rhino plugins that ship with Rhino
C:\Program Files\Rhino 8\Plug-ins\Commands.rhp “Commands” 8.16.24365.2001
C:\Program Files\Rhino 8\Plug-ins\WebBrowser.rhp “WebBrowser”
C:\Program Files\Rhino 8\Plug-ins\rdk.rhp “Renderer Development Kit”
C:\Program Files\Rhino 8\Plug-ins\RhinoScript.rhp “RhinoScript”
C:\Program Files\Rhino 8\Plug-ins\IdleProcessor.rhp “LeerlaufProzessor”
C:\Program Files\Rhino 8\Plug-ins\RhinoRenderCycles.rhp “Rhino Render” 8.16.24365.2001
C:\Program Files\Rhino 8\Plug-ins\rdk_etoui.rhp “RDK_EtoUI” 8.16.24365.2001
C:\Program Files\Rhino 8\Plug-ins\NamedSnapshots.rhp “Snapshots”
C:\Program Files\Rhino 8\Plug-ins\MeshCommands.rhp “MeshCommands” 8.16.24365.2001
C:\Program Files\Rhino 8\Plug-ins\RhinoCycles.rhp “RhinoCycles” 8.16.24365.2001
C:\Program Files\Rhino 8\Plug-ins\Toolbars\Toolbars.rhp “Toolbars” 8.16.24365.2001
C:\Program Files\Rhino 8\Plug-ins\3dxrhino.rhp “3Dconnexion 3D Mouse”
C:\Program Files\Rhino 8\Plug-ins\Displacement.rhp “Displacement”
C:\Program Files\Rhino 8\Plug-ins\Calc.rhp “Rechner”
C:\Program Files\Rhino 8\Plug-ins\SectionTools.rhp “SectionTools”
Yeah, sorry for that. I just wanted to ensure your hardware is capable of running Rhino 8 and the drivers are halfway up to date.
Yes, i’ve played with this for 15 minutes, applied some of the suggestions from above and came up with this: Renderingproblem_CG.3dm (477.7 KB)
Probably, i’ve been going light by light, isolated it and then increased intensities one by one so i can see how much impact each light has on the overall scene. Having a material for the groundplane instead of using constant helped a lot. You might change this from the Ground Plane panel:
While i’ve tested all this i’ve found some odds which might me worth for the developer to look at so i’m tagging @nathanletwory here.
I’ve noticed that wrong shadow coloring too when i canged colors for individual lights. It seemed to cure it self once i changed light positions slightly or when i turned off raytraced and back on.
That is clear, i was just suggesting to apply light colors so it is easier to distinguish between the lights when multiple lights are enabled. Once you’re happy with the lighting and shadowing you can of course switch them back to pure white.
Does my example file from above render something which looks like my example picture on your system ?
PS. Alles wird gut 
_
c.
Thanks again. Honestly, I would like it if an app worked and I didn’t have to search for settings until it worked.
With raytracing the scene goes black for me!
Only when I change the parameters is it calculated. do I have to behave according to Rhino’s wishes? Do you also have to build your computer according to Rhino’s peculiarities? How would this program like it…
I have copied a light from my first example into your scenes. now a tenth of the brightness is enough. Why?
Image X1
My newly opened example now looks like this. Is there any constant in Rhino regarding the rendering?
Bild X2
Here is the second scene with the values corrected according to your suggestion. It now looks like this. The system is on all the time, only the files were now closed. I don’t know of any other application on my system with such unstable behavior.
Nun die selbe Szene nach einem Neustart.
Cinema 4D läuft auf dem selben System seit Jahren stabil!
Auch mit einer Testversion von Octane habe ich nicht so ein kurioses Schauspiel. Gut, bislang waren das nur Tests. Dennoch gibt mir das zu denken.
You probably meant to say “light falloff not constant”
@Dietrich_Frank you should heed the directions given by @clement . It is probably a good idea to always change from constant light energy to at least linear falloff. And when you do inverse squared you’ll have to have higher energies.
Anyway, here your lights with linear falloff.
Sometimes you’ll need to toggle away from Raytraced and back to it again. Light shaders appear to get their wires crossed - I have not yet found why.
Anyway I don’t see shadows going the wrong direction, nor can I repeat the black-on-opening issues. Not on Windows on my RTX A6000 + RTX 6000 Ada, nor on my MacOS M2 Max.
Hi @nathanletwory, good you’re here now to help out. I’ve actually really meant that constant materials (not receiving any shading) might not be suited to handle lightning and shadowing problems as outlined by the user. Of course setting it to linear falloff helps, light energy is not really constant…
@Dietrich_Frank, please try to translate your posts with DeepL if possible.
_
c.
If the rendering is okay for them, then I realize why Rhino is the way it is. Too bad about the money.
Tue ich. Es steht gelegentlich auch drunter. DeepL setzt das manchmal drunter, mal nicht. Aber ich weiß, dass es falsch war Rhino zu kaufen. Nach der Antwort von @nathanletwory weiß ich das jetzt. Derart farbig erleuchtete Schatten sind ein Unding. Rhino hat sich damit für mich erledigt, da ich jetzt auch keine Verbesserungen mehr erwarte.
I don’t understand what constant materials are.
Setting to No Lighting will give you black viewport. No Lights = nothing will be visible. I don’t know why anybody would ever want to use this setting.
Raytraced can be properly used really only with Scene Lighting
It also renders fine on just CPU.
You were asked to post in English. I know German though.
Oh, so developers reacting even during the weekend is telling you we’re not going to try to improve Rhino?
Perhaps you’re right and Rhino maybe isn’t for you.
Anyway, if you had looked at the directions given by Clement and maybe hadn’t done stupid things like turning off lighting you may have had better luck.
I’ve found that if i have insane light intensity, i see strange colors too, even when light colors are all white. Btw. please change back your Raytraced settings to “Scene Lighting” which is the default setting. Restart Raytraced display after changing the setting.
You should give the developers a chance to find out if there are bugs or if the problem is in front of the keyboard. Start with a new empty scene, add a single light, record a video of it if you believe there are things going wrong. We’re just trying to help you.
_
c.
You can’t explain anything to someone who writes something like that. If a scene shows light and shadow without light, then something is wrong. That should demonstrate it. But you’re stupid because you say I’m stupid without understanding what it’s about!!! I’m not talking to you anymore. Anyone who thinks glowing shadows are a proper render is wrong at their job!
Insult your customers, but not with me!
The developer prefers to insult me. That’s no help. He doesn’t even understand what the example with the switched-off light was supposed to demonstrate. no, he calls me stupid.
a material which does not have shading eg. the Emission material is constant.
Probably my fault as it is shown in my screenshot above. Of course it should be set to use the lights in the scene. What new users might not expect is that if you turn off all lights in Rhino, you still get lighting so you’re not lost in in the darkness.
You can try this out yourself when Scene lighting is enabled for Raytraced. Turn off any lights from the Light panel, including Skylight and Sun, there still is lighting and a shadow. If you set it to “No lighting” and have all lights off, it really renders black, which imho is expected.
Rhino does this also for the Rendered and other displaymodes.
_
c.