Incredibly exciting potential with the iPad app! Thoughts and suggestions

[Edit: I read another post on this forum and see you’re working on a larger update to the UI, so you’re aware of the things I mention in this post. Excited to see what it’s like!]

I’ve been using Rhino since University and use it professionally and as a hobby now. Given the landscape of and industry workflows with the 3D modeling, I never expected to see this much functionality come to iRhino3D. You’re doing incredible work, @mkarimi

Maybe I haven’t explored the WIP app enough, but there are some big things that stick out that hinder usability.

  1. The tool panel and command should be locked or lockable. Having to drag the little tab out constantly is really tedious. On an iPad, swiping from the edge brings in the Slide Over window, so it’s really inconsistent to even be able to pull out the tool tab. When selecting snap objects, you have to keep reopening the window, and selecting a new snap point eg mid, near, vertex.

  2. Simply selecting something is not intuitive. I understand this is all WIP, but even on the release version just for markups, selecting an object feels tedious. Tapping and dragging, finger, mouse or pencil, all orbit the camera. A single tap selects…kind of. And a double tap zooms to extents. So when you’re trying to select an object, you’re constantly orbiting and zooming before anything selects. My suggestion would be a single tap is to select. Nothing else. Tap and drag is a selection box. Two finger orbits the camera. Three finger drag pans the camera.

Further on selecting, maybe it’s simply not functional yet, but it seems impossible to manipulate the gumball. I turned it on from the command box, but it’s impossible to select. You can use the move command, so manipulating geometry, including SubD, is working. But doing it via gumball is impossible.

  1. I suppose this is also to do with selection, or maybe the cursor, but there is no cursor. Let’s say you want to make a rectangle curve. I can’t see where the first point is, I can’t see the size of the box changing as I choose the next corner, and I can’t see where the next corner is. There needs to be a live cursor that indicates what you’re about to do.

These three things, Locked UI, functional selection, and command previews, are the biggest things that stop me from exploring and playing with the application more, and in turn submitting more meaningful feedback.

With that said, I’m amazed that you’re bringing this functionality to the mobile app. I hope McNeel understands the potential to dominate the mobile 3D modeling software market if this is done well. Right now, Shapr3D is the only viable option but functionally it is more akin to SolidWorks. Conceptual designers I think more lean towards Rhino. One of the great things about the iPad, that we see 2D art, is you can explore and create so much more freely.

I imagine a future where I can go to a site with my iPad, 3D scan it, sketch some ideas over the scan, and rough model them in without even sitting down. Imagine we even expand this to some kind of spatial AR markup. I can scan a site, markup with conceptual 3D sketches, and that can be anchored at full scale back at the site. Then a client can walk into the space, open their iPhone, and see the concept sketches at full scale, in AR.

I also have one last question. You just released Rhino 8 for Mac, with Metal Support. Aren’t Mac apps universal binaries, meaning it can just be ported over?

I understand you have somewhat limited resources to put into iRhino3D. But I also see you adding in Apples APIs for scanning Rooms and Objects, so it’s clear you’re mindful and knowledgeable of how Rhino and Apple hardware can work together to make something amazing.

Thank you for all the amazing work. Keep it up!

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Thanks for the detailed post, this is a great time to give feedback like this since I’m reworking the UI.

This panel is one of the major things I’m changing in the UI rewrite. I’m making the panel resizable and sticky.

I’m aware of the bug with object selection, this has been logged here, I hope we can fix that before we release the new UI.

This is on my radar, logged here

I had the same thought as well, mostly because I wanted to keep the orbit/pan functionality when you’re in a command (drawing curves for example). But most of our users use iRhino for viewing only. I think this proposed change is going to affect those users negatively. I need to think more about this one …

Gumball doesn’t work in iRhino yet. I have it logged here

I’m confused about this comment. The display updates as you move your finger on the screen. The trick is to keep your finger on the screen the whole time. First point will be placed when you pause your finger over an area, second point will be place when you release your finger. I added the delay mechanism so you can finetune the placement of the point, But maybe that’s dumb.

Newer Apple pencils have a hover feature that makes this possible. We’re not taking advantage of that in iRhino yet, but it’s on my list of things to do

A lot of APIs are different between iOS and MacOS. We use quite a bit of .Net in Rhino that’s not yet ported to iOS.

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Thanks for making this post (so I didn’t have to :wink:)! Very important comments and very good suggestions - all of them!

I think the suggestions @GrapesTogetherStrong made are the way selections and panning/rotating the view should work.
It might be that most users use iRhino for viewing only - for now. That’s probably/hopefully going to change.

Well, it kind of works - but not always, as I mentioned earlier - at least not on my old iPad…

In any case, I don’t think it’s a very intuitive - or quick - way of modelling. Drawing lines or sketching should be as easy and intuitive as working with pencil and paper.

Thanks for listening!

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By the way… I don’t get the magnifying glass over the cursor (where it should be) - mine is always in the upper right corner…? iPad Pro from 2017 - to old?

The default position is upper right corner. But you can change it in Settings>Interactions>Loupe Position:

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Aha, thanks! I should have found that my self… :smiling_face:

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I can give this a try. Logged here: https://mcneel.myjetbrains.com/youtrack/issue/RV-931/Add-gesture-for-window-selection

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