Unable to organize layers by dragging

Hi there, I’m trying to reorganize layers by dragging and dropping, but every time I grab a layer it won’t let me. It started a day ago, and it doesn’t work in a new model either.

pls post your systeminfo

Rhino 8 SR15 2025-1-19 (Rhino 8, 8.15.25019.13001, Git hash:master @ 74164bdf5469c2f269746857c54b8c44b74c7b24)
License type: Educational, build 2025-01-19
License details: Cloud Zoo

Windows 11 (10.0.26100 SR0.0) or greater (Physical RAM: 32GB)
.NET 7.0.0

Computer platform: LAPTOP - Plugged in [100% battery remaining]

Hybrid graphics configuration.
Primary display: Intel(R) Iris(R) Plus Graphics (Intel) Memory: 1GB, Driver date: 7-21-2022 (M-D-Y).
> Integrated graphics device with 3 adapter port(s)
- Windows Main Display is laptop’s integrated screen or built-in port
- Secondary monitor attached to adapter port #1
Primary OpenGL: NVIDIA GeForce GTX 1660 Ti with Max-Q Design (NVidia) Memory: 6GB, Driver date: 11-6-2024 (M-D-Y). OpenGL Ver: 4.6.0 NVIDIA 566.14
> Integrated accelerated graphics device (shares primary device ports)
- Video pass-through to primary display device

OpenGL Settings
Safe mode: Off
Use accelerated hardware modes: On
GPU Tessellation is: On
Redraw scene when viewports are exposed: On
Graphics level being used: OpenGL 4.6 (primary GPU’s maximum)

Anti-alias mode: 4x
Mip Map Filtering: Linear
Anisotropic Filtering Mode: High

Vendor Name: NVIDIA Corporation
Render version: 4.6
Shading Language: 4.60 NVIDIA
Driver Date: 11-6-2024
Driver Version: 32.0.15.6614
Maximum Texture size: 32768 x 32768
Z-Buffer depth: 24 bits
Maximum Viewport size: 32768 x 32768
Total Video Memory: 6 GB

Rhino plugins that do not ship with Rhino
C:\Program Files\Enscape\Enscape.Rhino.Plugin-net48\Enscape.Rhino8.Plugin.dll “Enscape.Rhino8.Plugin” 4.2.1.88

Rhino plugins that ship with Rhino
C:\Program Files\Rhino 8\Plug-ins\Commands.rhp “Commands” 8.15.25019.13001
C:\Program Files\Rhino 8\Plug-ins\WebBrowser.rhp “WebBrowser”
C:\Program Files\Rhino 8\Plug-ins\rdk.rhp “Renderer Development Kit”
C:\Program Files\Rhino 8\Plug-ins\RhinoScript.rhp “RhinoScript”
C:\Program Files\Rhino 8\Plug-ins\RhinoLabsTools.rhp “Rhino Labs Tools”
C:\Program Files\Rhino 8\Plug-ins\IdleProcessor.rhp “IdleProcessor”
C:\Program Files\Rhino 8\Plug-ins\RhinoRenderCycles.rhp “Rhino Render” 8.15.25019.13001
C:\Program Files\Rhino 8\Plug-ins\RhinoRender.rhp “Legacy Rhino Render”
C:\Program Files\Rhino 8\Plug-ins\rdk_etoui.rhp “RDK_EtoUI” 8.15.25019.13001
C:\Program Files\Rhino 8\Plug-ins\NamedSnapshots.rhp “Snapshots”
C:\Program Files\Rhino 8\Plug-ins\MeshCommands.rhp “MeshCommands” 8.15.25019.13001
C:\Program Files\Rhino 8\Plug-ins\RhinoCycles.rhp “RhinoCycles” 8.15.25019.13001
C:\Program Files\Rhino 8\Plug-ins\Toolbars\Toolbars.rhp “Toolbars” 8.15.25019.13001
C:\Program Files\Rhino 8\Plug-ins\3dxrhino.rhp “3Dconnexion 3D Mouse”
C:\Program Files\Rhino 8\Plug-ins\Displacement.rhp “Displacement”
C:\Program Files\Rhino 8\Plug-ins\SectionTools.rhp “SectionTools”

Hi Stephanie -

Do you know what changed on your system at that point?
-wim

I took a Windows update, but no other changes to my system that I’m aware of.

Hi Stephanie -

Thanks. That’s about as big a change as you can get.
I’d first try a “Repair” of the Rhino installation from the Windows Control Panel.
-wim

That fixed it - thanks very much!

I’m sorry to report that the behavior is back. :frowning: After it started working again, I updated my graphics driver. Even after another repair and restart, it still won’t let me drag between layers again.

Rhino 8 SR15 2025-1-19 (Rhino 8, 8.15.25019.13001, Git hash:master @ 74164bdf5469c2f269746857c54b8c44b74c7b24)
License type: Educational, build 2025-01-19
License details: Cloud Zoo

Windows 11 (10.0.26100 SR0.0) or greater (Physical RAM: 32GB)
.NET 7.0.0

Computer platform: LAPTOP - Plugged in [100% battery remaining]

Hybrid graphics configuration.
Primary display: Intel(R) Iris(R) Plus Graphics (Intel) Memory: 1GB, Driver date: 7-21-2022 (M-D-Y).
> Integrated graphics device with 3 adapter port(s)
- Windows Main Display is laptop’s integrated screen or built-in port
- Secondary monitor attached to adapter port #1
Primary OpenGL: NVIDIA GeForce GTX 1660 Ti with Max-Q Design (NVidia) Memory: 6GB, Driver date: 1-26-2025 (M-D-Y). OpenGL Ver: 4.6.0 NVIDIA 572.16
> Integrated accelerated graphics device (shares primary device ports)
- Video pass-through to primary display device

OpenGL Settings
Safe mode: Off
Use accelerated hardware modes: On
GPU Tessellation is: On
Redraw scene when viewports are exposed: On
Graphics level being used: OpenGL 4.6 (primary GPU’s maximum)

Anti-alias mode: 4x
Mip Map Filtering: Linear
Anisotropic Filtering Mode: High

Vendor Name: NVIDIA Corporation
Render version: 4.6
Shading Language: 4.60 NVIDIA
Driver Date: 1-26-2025
Driver Version: 32.0.15.7216
Maximum Texture size: 32768 x 32768
Z-Buffer depth: 24 bits
Maximum Viewport size: 32768 x 32768
Total Video Memory: 6 GB

Rhino plugins that do not ship with Rhino
C:\Program Files\Enscape\Enscape.Rhino.Plugin-net48\Enscape.Rhino8.Plugin.dll “Enscape.Rhino8.Plugin” 4.2.1.88

Rhino plugins that ship with Rhino
C:\Program Files\Rhino 8\Plug-ins\Commands.rhp “Commands” 8.15.25019.13001
C:\Program Files\Rhino 8\Plug-ins\rdk.rhp “Renderer Development Kit”
C:\Program Files\Rhino 8\Plug-ins\RhinoRenderCycles.rhp “Rhino Render” 8.15.25019.13001
C:\Program Files\Rhino 8\Plug-ins\rdk_etoui.rhp “RDK_EtoUI” 8.15.25019.13001
C:\Program Files\Rhino 8\Plug-ins\NamedSnapshots.rhp “Snapshots”
C:\Program Files\Rhino 8\Plug-ins\MeshCommands.rhp “MeshCommands” 8.15.25019.13001
C:\Program Files\Rhino 8\Plug-ins\RhinoCycles.rhp “RhinoCycles” 8.15.25019.13001
C:\Program Files\Rhino 8\Plug-ins\Toolbars\Toolbars.rhp “Toolbars” 8.15.25019.13001
C:\Program Files\Rhino 8\Plug-ins\3dxrhino.rhp “3Dconnexion 3D Mouse”
C:\Program Files\Rhino 8\Plug-ins\Displacement.rhp “Displacement”
C:\Program Files\Rhino 8\Plug-ins\SectionTools.rhp “SectionTools”

Hi Stephanie -

As a way of troubleshooting, what happens when you disable that plug-in in the Plug-in Manager and then restart Rhino? Does that make a difference?
-wim

No, same behavior.

Hi Stephanie,
You get this “no” symbol" when a command is active or where you are dropping the layer where is not acceptable. Or there is a command active that is preventing the Layer shuffle to occur.

We need a good screen capture video or image to see exactly where you are picking, and not so much at an angle would be better.
What does the entire screen look like? Is there a command active.
Cell phone images/videos are not good. Windows SnipIt is better.
You said Reset and it fixed it and them it started happening again?

Do you see the issue dragging layers in a new file?
If this is only happening in an existing file, upload here and include the Forum link. Or zip and email tech@mcneel.com if it is a small file.

  1. Disable Enscape in Options → Plugins.
  2. Reset Rhino
  3. Now test.

If you still have the issue, email us at tech@mcneel.com
Reference the Forum thread and include the new SystemInfo, with the latest configuration of your Rhino.

You can also call us. See hour and phone number for support here.

Thanks for your help.
Sincerely,
Mary Ann Fugier

Here’s the behavior with a brand new file, no command active, Enscape disabled. I’ve also reproduced this with one of the rhino template files (instead of my custom template) as well as several of my models.

The first repair I did, after having taken a windows update, did fix it. I took an update of my graphics driver and it broke again. Several more repairs didn’t fix the problem either.

Thanks for your help! System info below as well.

Rhino 8 SR15 2025-1-19 (Rhino 8, 8.15.25019.13001, Git hash:master @ 74164bdf5469c2f269746857c54b8c44b74c7b24)
License type: Educational, build 2025-01-19
License details: Cloud Zoo

Windows 11 (10.0.26100 SR0.0) or greater (Physical RAM: 32GB)
.NET 7.0.0

Computer platform: LAPTOP - Plugged in [100% battery remaining]

Hybrid graphics configuration.
Primary display: Intel(R) Iris(R) Plus Graphics (Intel) Memory: 1GB, Driver date: 7-21-2022 (M-D-Y).
> Integrated graphics device with 3 adapter port(s)
- Windows Main Display is laptop’s integrated screen or built-in port
- Secondary monitor attached to adapter port #1
Primary OpenGL: NVIDIA GeForce GTX 1660 Ti with Max-Q Design (NVidia) Memory: 6GB, Driver date: 1-26-2025 (M-D-Y). OpenGL Ver: 4.6.0 NVIDIA 572.16
> Integrated accelerated graphics device (shares primary device ports)
- Video pass-through to primary display device

OpenGL Settings
Safe mode: Off
Use accelerated hardware modes: On
GPU Tessellation is: On
Redraw scene when viewports are exposed: On
Graphics level being used: OpenGL 4.6 (primary GPU’s maximum)

Anti-alias mode: 4x
Mip Map Filtering: Linear
Anisotropic Filtering Mode: High

Vendor Name: NVIDIA Corporation
Render version: 4.6
Shading Language: 4.60 NVIDIA
Driver Date: 1-26-2025
Driver Version: 32.0.15.7216
Maximum Texture size: 32768 x 32768
Z-Buffer depth: 24 bits
Maximum Viewport size: 32768 x 32768
Total Video Memory: 6 GB

Rhino plugins that do not ship with Rhino

Rhino plugins that ship with Rhino
C:\Program Files\Rhino 8\Plug-ins\Commands.rhp “Commands” 8.15.25019.13001
C:\Program Files\Rhino 8\Plug-ins\rdk.rhp “Renderer Development Kit”
C:\Program Files\Rhino 8\Plug-ins\RhinoRenderCycles.rhp “Rhino Render” 8.15.25019.13001
C:\Program Files\Rhino 8\Plug-ins\rdk_etoui.rhp “RDK_EtoUI” 8.15.25019.13001
C:\Program Files\Rhino 8\Plug-ins\NamedSnapshots.rhp “Snapshots”
C:\Program Files\Rhino 8\Plug-ins\MeshCommands.rhp “MeshCommands” 8.15.25019.13001
C:\Program Files\Rhino 8\Plug-ins\RhinoCycles.rhp “RhinoCycles” 8.15.25019.13001
C:\Program Files\Rhino 8\Plug-ins\Toolbars\Toolbars.rhp “Toolbars” 8.15.25019.13001
C:\Program Files\Rhino 8\Plug-ins\3dxrhino.rhp “3Dconnexion 3D Mouse”
C:\Program Files\Rhino 8\Plug-ins\Displacement.rhp “Displacement”
C:\Program Files\Rhino 8\Plug-ins\SectionTools.rhp “SectionTools”

Hi @stephanie3000,
Please email us at tech@mcneel.com, Attn Mary.
We need to schedule a screen share to look at your computer and what may be causing this issue.

Let us know times that work for you.
Sincerely,
Mary Ann Fugier

I have the same problem! repair didn’t help me, problems are both in a new file and existing files…

Hi Mia,
Let’s start with your SystemInfo.
In Rhino type SystemInfo command.
Copy and paste the text results into your reply.

I just worked with a customer that had this layer drag issue.
The problem was related to:

  1. His laptop being unplugged
  2. Nvidia being the primary display/OpenGL.

It was resolved by:

  1. Closing Rhino.
  2. Plugin in the computer to power
  3. Setting Rhino to High Performance as instructed by this Forum link
  4. Then restarting Rhino.

Always get all the updates from your display card manufactures. Windows updates do not do this. You may need to check AMD, Intel or Nvidia website and download the latest diaply drivers for you primary and secondary cards.

If any of this helps, let us know.
Sincerely,
Mary Ann Fugier

This issue is open and unresolved.

Details:

  • Customers with two monitors put the Layer panel on the Main Display and they can “drag and drop” layers.
  • If the layer panel is placed on the smaller “non-Main” display, the layer cannot be dragged and the universal “NO” symbol is shown.
  • However, the arrow keys can be used to move the layer up, down and over in the list.
  • Customer believe it started happening in sr14.

We have logged Unable to Drag Layers RH-85970
We are still unable to get the correct combination to repeat it on one of our computers.
If you are having this issue, feel free to add any details that will help us duplicate this here.

Thanks for your help.
Sincerely,
Mary Ann Fugier

I was able to drag and drop by moving my layers panel to my main monitor, If I set my external monitor as my main monitor, this is fine as a workaround for me - thank you.

Still not able to do it on my secondary monitor. I did follow the steps to make sure Rhino was set to high performance, and all my display drivers are the up to date according to the manufacturers.

1 Like

Dear Mary Ann,

Without me doing anything, dragging layers now works again. Very mysterious! But thanks for now, hopefully the problem doesn’t come back.
Thanks for your comment about display card updates.

Best,
Mia

1 Like

Hi @stephanie3000,
Thanks for the update and the additional details.
Last week we logged RH-85970/Unable-to-Drag-Layers On Secondary Monitor

We will notify you here when there is a fix to test.
Sincerely,
Mary Ann Fugier

Hi Mia,
Last week we logged RH-85970/Unable-to-Drag-Layers On Secondary Monitor

Did you do any display driver updates?
Did you change the resolution of the displays?
Just curious if there is a reason outside of a Rhino update that would “fix” this issue.

Sincerely,
Mary Ann Fugier