Rhino 8 Clipping drawing not fit for printing layouts?

[Jakob_Lunden_Jakobse (Jakob Lunden Jakobsen)]

Hi all

I am trying to use the new clipping drawing options for Rhino 8. My goal is to create a section that updates with the 3D model - directly ready to print from the layouts. There are two options to do this. However i can’t get either one to work for printing.

Option 1.

Set a layout view to point directly at the clipped 3D model, and check the marker in clipping plane the for that layout view.

It looks like this in model space - no issues

It looks like this in the layout space - no issues - I use the “shaded” view.

But when trying to print in either vector or raster it looks like this:

Everything is off… I tried setting it to “monochrome” or “wireframe” before printing, but that just makes it all worse.

Option 2.

Use the command “Clippingdrawings” to create an updatable 2D preview of the section in model space, and then point a layout page towards that in plan.

Model space looks good in 3D - no issues

But model space in plan and also the layout space looks like this:

Hatches missing, line weights shifting etc. I use the “wireframe” view, using “shaded” it makes it worse.

Print looks like this:

The line weights are off

I want to achive something in print similar to the second picture i posted (Layout 1).
Doing this is essential for architects, so i hope it is duable somehow…

All the best

Jakob

[wim (Wim Dekeyser)]

Hej Jakob -

@Jakob_Lunden_Jakobse

However i can’t get either one to work for printing.

Please post the output of the Rhino SystemInfo command and a *.3dm file that we can use to trouble-shoot the issue.
-wim

[Jakob_Lunden_Jakobse (Jakob Lunden Jakobsen)]

Hi Wim!

A little more info…
I guess my goal is to get a nice vector file to PDF. I know that the second option gives me the possibility to edit a set of new layers which is created with the 2D file in model space. But this has several issues on its own. First off, this does not draw information from the source layers of the 3D model, which means one has to do all the layering every time a new section is created. Secondly, it has issues differentiating between blocks and normal polysurfaces. This means that blocks have to be exploded in order for this method to work.

3Dm file:
Clipping Drawing issue 04-06-24.3dm (12.4 MB)

SystemInfo:

Rhino 8 SR7 2024-5-17 (Rhino 8, 8.7.24138.15431, Git hash:master @ 03702f889bdef32626af4bca510b5e8a85666d38)
License type: Commercial, build 2024-05-17
License details: Cloud Zoo

Windows 10 (10.0.19045 SR0.0) or greater (Physical RAM: 16GB)
.NET 7.0.0

Computer platform: LAPTOP - Plugged in [100% battery remaining]

Hybrid graphics configuration.
Primary display: Intel(R) UHD Graphics (Intel) Memory: 1GB, Driver date: 8-19-2022 (M-D-Y).
> Integrated graphics device with 4 adapter port(s)
- Laptop lid is possibly closed
- Windows Main Display attached to adapter port #1
Primary OpenGL: NVIDIA GeForce RTX 3060 Laptop GPU (NVidia) Memory: 6GB, Driver date: 5-13-2024 (M-D-Y). OpenGL Ver: 4.6.0 NVIDIA 555.85
> Integrated accelerated graphics device with 4 adapter port(s)
- Video pass-through to primary display device

OpenGL Settings
Safe mode: Off
Use accelerated hardware modes: On
Redraw scene when viewports are exposed: On
Graphics level being used: OpenGL 4.6 (primary GPU’s maximum)

Anti-alias mode: None
Mip Map Filtering: Linear
Anisotropic Filtering Mode: High

Vendor Name: NVIDIA Corporation
Render version: 4.6
Shading Language: 4.60 NVIDIA
Driver Date: 5-13-2024
Driver Version: 32.0.15.5585
Maximum Texture size: 32768 x 32768
Z-Buffer depth: 24 bits
Maximum Viewport size: 32768 x 32768
Total Video Memory: 6 GB

Rhino plugins that do not ship with Rhino
C:\Users\jakob\AppData\Local\Programs\Enscape\Bin64\Enscape.Rhino8.Plugin.dll “Enscape.Rhino8.Plugin” 0.0.23328.1419
C:\Program Files\Chaos Group\V-Ray\V-Ray for Rhinoceros\V8\VRayForRhino.rhp “V-Ray for Rhino”

Rhino plugins that ship with Rhino
C:\Program Files\Rhino 8\Plug-ins\Commands.rhp “Commands” 8.7.24138.15431
C:\Program Files\Rhino 8\Plug-ins\WebBrowser.rhp “WebBrowser”
C:\Program Files\Rhino 8\Plug-ins\rdk.rhp “Renderer Development Kit”
C:\Program Files\Rhino 8\Plug-ins\RhinoScript.rhp “RhinoScript”
C:\Program Files\Rhino 8\Plug-ins\IdleProcessor.rhp “IdleProcessor”
C:\Program Files\Rhino 8\Plug-ins\RhinoRenderCycles.rhp “Rhino Render” 8.7.24138.15431
C:\Program Files\Rhino 8\Plug-ins\RhinoRender.rhp “Legacy Rhino Render”
C:\Program Files\Rhino 8\Plug-ins\rdk_etoui.rhp “RDK_EtoUI” 8.7.24138.15431
C:\Program Files\Rhino 8\Plug-ins\NamedSnapshots.rhp “Snapshots”
C:\Program Files\Rhino 8\Plug-ins\MeshCommands.rhp “MeshCommands” 8.7.24138.15431
C:\Program Files\Rhino 8\Plug-ins\RhinoCycles.rhp “RhinoCycles” 8.7.24138.15431
C:\Program Files\Rhino 8\Plug-ins\export_PDF.rhp “PDF Export” 8.7.24138.15431
C:\Program Files\Rhino 8\Plug-ins\Toolbars\Toolbars.rhp “Toolbars” 8.7.24138.15431
C:\Program Files\Rhino 8\Plug-ins\3dxrhino.rhp “3Dconnexion 3D Mouse”
C:\Program Files\Rhino 8\Plug-ins\BlockEdit.rhp “BlockEdit” 8.7.24138.15431
C:\Program Files\Rhino 8\Plug-ins\Displacement.rhp “Displacement”
C:\Program Files\Rhino 8\Plug-ins\Calc.rhp “Calc”
C:\Program Files\Rhino 8\Plug-ins\SectionTools.rhp “SectionTools”

[wim (Wim Dekeyser)]

Hej Jakob -

@Jakob_Lunden_Jakobse

3Dm file:
Clipping Drawing issue 04-06-24.3dm (12.4 MB)

Thanks for that file!
It looks like you have hit an untested combination of custom clipping depth, selective clipping participation, and blocks with this one.
I’ve put this on the list as RH-82412 Print: Messy Vector Output of Selectively Participating Block with Custom Clipping Depth

As for the second option:

@Jakob_Lunden_Jakobse

Secondly, it has issues differentiating between blocks and normal polysurfaces.

Could you pin-point where this is going wrong in that model?
You are running 8.7 and I’m on 8.9 and it’s possible a bug that you are running into has been fixed in the meanwhile, but this is what I get from the clipping drawing:
2D model preview to layout - A5.pdf (42.1 KB)

@Jakob_Lunden_Jakobse

First off, this does not draw information from the source layers of the 3D model, which means one has to do all the layering every time a new section is created.

I’m not sure what, exactly, that means, but perhaps @rajaa has more ideas and/or questions around this.
-wim

[Jakob_Lunden_Jakobse (Jakob Lunden Jakobsen)]

Hi again,

I figured as much:

Option 1 only prints in raster and not vector. This can generate good results in the “shaded” view mode, but only if I bump up the resolution of the image to around 3000 dots/inch. This creates a VERY heavy image for Adobe PDF to view. I can already tell that this is not a good solution for architects as one typically works in sets of maybe 10-15 drawings per project. And it would slow down the workflow significantly.

layout direct.pdf (4.9 MB)

The heaviness disappears if I print in “wireframe view”, but then the print is unfit for obvious reasons.

layout direct wreframe.pdf (73.1 KB)

Option 2 prints in vector, and I see the result you got is better than what I achieved. I will see when the 8.9 update is out. But I can still tell that your result has issues as well.

1. Notice how the brick in the back of the image has a way too thick line. The main issue is that rhino doesn’t use the same line weights in the 2D drawing as they are defined and seen in the clipped 3D model. The clipped edge should be thicker than the background.

It should look like this:

2. I experience a bug where the 2D preview created by “clipping drawings” disappears when running the “update clipping drawings” acommand and using the “all” option. This happens after editing the section style of the 3D model and then running the “update clipping drawings” command.

3. Lines go trough clipped objects if they touch the other end of them
   

   
   
   
   

I’m at a loss here. It’s very frustrating since I bought Rhino 8 specifically for this set of functions…

[rajaa (Rajaa Issa)]

@Jakob_Lunden_Jakobse

It’s very frustrating

I understand your frustration. As you mentioned, this is a new set of tools, and we are actively fixing the bugs as they get reported. It is good to work with the latest service release candidate to get the weekly update.

About option#1 and the printing issues of clipped views, I think @wim or @mary can help better.

I’ll speak to option#2 (create dynamic drawings using ClippingDrawings command)

@Jakob_Lunden_Jakobse

Notice how the brick in the back of the image has a way too thick line.

I will try to isolate a small model with the stairs and a few bricks to test.

@Jakob_Lunden_Jakobse

2D preview created by “clipping drawings” disappears when running the “update clipping drawings” acommand and using the “all” option.

I see that if you run “UpdateClippingDrawings” when you are in layout view (without clicking inside the detail to make active), the drawing disappear indeed. This is a bug logged here…

@Jakob_Lunden_Jakobse

Lines go trough clipped objects if they touch the other end of them

This has been improved and you should see a difference in the next release. I do see a couple line still when use a block. Will investigate further.

[wim (Wim Dekeyser)]

Hi Jakob -

@Jakob_Lunden_Jakobse

Option 1 only prints in raster and not vector.

I agree that this is not working as it should for vector. As I mentioned, this is on the list as RH-82412 Print: Messy Vector Output of Selectively Participating Block with Custom Clipping Depth

@Jakob_Lunden_Jakobse

This can generate good results in the “shaded” view mode, but only if I bump up the resolution of the image to around 3000 dots/inch.

How would you do this in Rhino 7, or was this an equally bad workflow in Rhino 7?

@Jakob_Lunden_Jakobse

1. Notice how the brick in the back of the image has a way too thick line. The main issue is that rhino doesn’t use the same line weights in the 2D drawing as they are defined and seen in the clipped 3D model. The clipped edge should be thicker than the background.

Two notes on this one. It looks like the print width is used for the parent “Background” layer, and not for the child “Visible” layer that the curves are placed on:

I’ll file that. In the meanwhile, you should be able to change the print width of the correct layer for those background items.

Apart from that, it looks like the section hatch is being placed on top of the section outline. The solid hatch of those stairs being white, this masks half of the outline width and the curves look like they are more narrow then they actually are.

You can unlock that “Curve” layer and move the objects on that layer to the front with the BringToFront command.

@Jakob_Lunden_Jakobse

3. Lines go trough clipped objects if they touch the other end of them

Rajaa says she’s investigating this further. For the time being, you can use the SendToBack command on the objects on that “Background::Visible” layer.
-wim