Re-upload while retaining light settings?

I simply can’t figure out how I can “re-upload” a scene and retain the lighting settings. When I chose a new file (almost identical to the old one), the lighting settings are all back to the default and under “load light scene” I only see “default” and “legacy”.

This surely can’t be how it was designed to work. Why have re-upload but then it changes the lights and I can’t load the light scene. As mentioned before saving light-scenes only makes sense if they are global, meaning if I save the light scene in one model I want to be able to see that in another model.

I mean I don’t want to be too critical here, but the whole experience of setting up the model and parameters on shapediver.com is a huge mess. Its unintuitive, cumbersome and has many bugs for the little functionality it actually has. Setting up lights is unusually hard, especially since any edits you make wont be very permanent. You always end up setting up all the settings again any time you upload something. You can’t rename lights and they have typical developer names like “DIRECTIONAL0”, “DIRECTIONAL1”, etc. That is a perfect example of developers being in charge of functionality and interface design, which is exactly the impression I get from it. A bit of UX and basically a redesign of the whole editor are the only ways out of this that I can see.

The biggest problem really is that it would be much more sensible to set everything up in Rhino/GH already, but that would mean you would have to have the same viewer model in Rhino as on Shapediver.

Just noticed another weird thing in the model editor on shapediver.com.

Why does the ambient occlusion fade in over around 3 seconds. You rotate the model and the ambient occlusion is gone and then again fades in over a few seconds. Why?

Could you please explain how the saved light scenes are at least supposed to work?

After playing with this for ages now I simply cannot figure out what they are supposed to be used for. You can’t use them when you re-upload and you can’t use them for other models you upload. It saves the light setup anyways, so why the need to save multiple if you cant ever re-use it? I can understand them if you could use them for both, but I can’t believe you would implement this functionality without it having that utility/

I am so sick of setting the lights up again every single time I re-upload.

Okay, I think I am starting to understand:

If you just edit the lights but don’t save it as a scene, it doesn’t get saved. So unlike all the other settings in the model editor, the lights have to be saved separately. Why that happens and why it doesn’t say that anywhere is beyond me.

That’s all there seems to be to it. But then the question is why bother? Why not just save the lights I set up with the model like all the other settings and thats it. Why save it separately, which suggest you do that to use it elsewhere, which would make total sense.

Yes, you need to hit the Save Light Scene button to save lights and then Apply Settings button to save everything. Once you are done with the settings, you can use the re-upload feature with following models to save some time.

We know this is not ideal user experience and improvements of light settings are on our road map. Thank you for your feedback.

Thanks for clarifying. What’s weird though it seems like that only works if I re-upload the same file (filename). If I re-upload with a different filename my light settings are once again lost. How come it doesn’t retain the light setup then?

I just tried to re-upload with different filename and I couldn’t reproduce the issue. When re-uploading, you can specify model settings to copy in the second step. Are you sure you chose the right model?

@pavol That is not what is happening for me:

  1. See the current settings. There is a light scene called “scene”. I press re-upload:

  2. Its uploaded and I can give it a new name:

  3. I say to use the settings of the file I am re-uploading (so default):

  4. The light scenes are back to the default and my saved light scene is nowhere to be seen and I have to set it all up again:

How do you do what you are talking about? Of course that’s how it should work. But in my opinion light scenes that you saved should be available for ALL your models. Why wouldn’t it be? There is plenty of space in the dropdown! So that way I don’t have to even re-upload. When it asks to use the previous settings of a model, why isnt the light scene part of it?

So basically if I reupload you dont get the light settings and you dont get the model parameters set up as before. So basically the 2 things that take any time in setting up!?

Also why can I only apply settings of a different model during upload? Why not if I just go to Edit Model??

Last question: If I just go to upload a new file, during upload under Model Settings it shows a dropdown to “Use the settings of a previous model”. But in the dropdown there are only models from 2016, non of which are MY models, but other peoples. What is the point of that?? Why can’t I see my own models? Surely I would only want to use settings of my own models where I might know what I set up. Why and how would I choose a model I know nothing about and can’t see what settings are?

Could you please explain the reasoning behind all these choices to make it work like that and not a more intuitive way? Do you have a UX person at Shapediver? It doesn’t seem like it unfortunately otherwise there wouldn’t be these most basic of blunders in the usability…

I think I see where the bug is. Its either because you can rename the model during re-upload or you can use a different filename than the original model. Either one of them causes the light settings to disappear.

So following good UX principles it should either:

  1. not let you rename a model when you are re-uploading

  2. let you rename and still copy the settings (ie. the sensible and most logical way)

  3. warn you that it will not copy the settings because you have renamed the model

or 4) let you apply model settings even after you have (re)uploaded a file and let you choose the model settings of any of your previous uploads

The fact that it does NEITHER of those 4 options, but should in fact do all or at least one of them, tells me that it was either “designed” by a developer (no offence to them, what they do is great, but UX is just a different skill-set altogether), you should get a better UX person or at least a better product manager.

Actually I just found another bug:

If you Edit a model and go to the light settings it will show you the light settings you have saved, but the actual controls it shows you are for the default lights:

You have to load the default light scene, then switch to the saved light scene so it actually loads the controls for your saved light scene:

Lastly if you are refactoring the whole viewer settings thing, which in my opinion you should, could you please also give more sensible auto-names to the lights? The default ones are DIRECTIONAL0 and DIRECTIONAL1, but than if you add a light its first DIRECTIONAL and then DIRECTIONAL_1, meaning you have 3 different naming conventions in there. Either always start at 0 or at 1 and always have an underscore or not.

Just by seeing the name “DIRECTIONAL0” I can tell that this was all completely done by developers. I code myself and know its easiest to just go for that, but as a UX Designer I would say you should call them something like “Directional Light 1”, because thats just how HUMANS write stuff.

I guess we should have labeled the lighting settings as Beta when we released them. As it goes, we developed them because several clients needed them, and hesitated before including them as a product feature. We are well aware that this first version is not the most intuitive and probably still contains some bugs.

In short, everything you have reported related to the UX is fair, and will be improved.

It is indeed not ideal that light scenes need to be saved once and then saved again when applying global settings. In general, we also agree that scene settings could be shared globally among the models of a specific user, and when we do update this feature we will take that into account.

This bug has already been reported and will be fixed soon. The idea is to list the user’s models first (by chronological order, starting from the most recent) and then public models as well because a user might want to re-use settings of a scene he has found and likes. Does that sound reasonable from a UX point of view? It might also not be obvious but the text input is a search tool, so if you start typing a model name it will provide relevant options in the dropdown.

Regarding this bug, I tried a lot of cases and I cannot reproduce it. Does it happen systematically for you, or just randomly once in a while? It might be a timing issue.

Following what I said above, option 2 is the way it is supposed to work, and the way it works throughout my tests so far. I will keep looking for cases that could produce it.

We do not have a dedicated UX expert in our team yet. At the moment, I am the closest to what you would call a product manager in ShapeDiver, so rest assured that your abrasive feedback is heard loud and clear.