Offset and Ortho problems in Perspective view

Perhaps I shouldn’t even ask, but I’m having big problems drawing a simple house in 3D using Perspective view.

OFFSET VERTICAL LINES
For example, I have vertical lines which I want to offset from a corner in a room (a typical “contruction lines” case), but pffft, offset simply refuses to spit out an offset line. Isn’t offsetting vertical lines supported? (or, not supported in Perspective view?)

"WEAK" ORTHO
Another problem is that Ortho influence is extremely “weak”. Does it work at all? Just about anything else that can “disturb” takes precendence over Ortho, like Osnap to any silly geometry nearby or faaaaaaar behind, and even if nothing is nearby the Ortho mode is releases when moving the mouse the slightest off the ortho path. It’s actually useless.

I never had any problems like this with R5 (except for the totally mental “snap-to-any-irrelevant-crap-located-far-behind-any-objects-in-front”, a totally backwards strategy which I simply cannot understand…).

// Rolf

Hi Rolf - Offset is a planar operation, so to speak - - there is no plane inherent in a line, and the CPlane does not help in this case - What would be the expected offset direction?

-Pascal

Offset in any Ortho direction. Well, that’s what I would expect.

But then the Ortho problem is there as well. It’s essential for Copy and Move etc, but it’s hopeless.

I just made a number of changes to a model after review - lots of moving and copying. The sloppy Ortho snap makes it a pain, and error prone (off plane). It just doesn’t work.

If Ortho strength can’t be adjusted it’s really worthless. I have to draw helper lines all over the model only due to its sloppyness.

In Rhino 5 at least Ortho worked. In R6 it doesnt.

// Rolf

Hi Rolf - I do not see this here, especially

Is there any other snap or SmartTrack in action?

-Pascal

Yes. As a last resort yes. Although that comes with other problems due to a house drawing attracting mouse clicks to everything else but objects in front.

WANNABE MIDPOINT
Another problem which fooled me totally is that midpoint doesn’t atually give midpoint for objects that has been cut, like in this case a window frame, which had me spend hours making the smaller window frame to fit only on one side before I discovered it. It turned out only later I was significantly off center (see orange and red curves).

bild

Now, this ended up in a mess before I understod what was going on but I attach the win drawing anyway. Do you see the same off-center-wannabe-midpoint? Or am I totally off myself? :grinning:

Btw, I’m not an architect, just trying to draw my daughters house prospect according to her “visions”.

Forum Window Off Center 1200x1600 mm.3dm (6.0 MB)

// Rolf

Hi Rolf - the vertical orange line looks correct, correct?, for the overall window width - how did you get the red line?

-Pascal

Yes, the orange is correct, but that was becaue I draw a separate line along the beam and pegged the midpoint from that line instead. The red one is picked from the beam directly.

You can see on the isocurves on the beam that it has been cut off from a longer beam at some point in time. I noticed this on another object too, that midpoint goes bananas on objects that has been cut/split.

// Rolf

Now I remember. I first made the “standing” beams (1600mm) and then rotated a copy and cut it to 1200mm.

Try that and see if also you get the midpoint messed up on the beam that is cut, by doing so.

// Rolf

Yeah… the Mid snap will find mid points of edges… the edges in this case are uneven polylines-

I do not see why that is the case when DupEdge finds the whole thing … still poking…

-Pascal

Hm, where does that mess come from? I tried exploding my upper beam and turned on CPs, but all I see is the unshrinked surfaces (since it was cut from a longer 1600mm beam).

Strange. How do you make it look like that? I don’t see that point-mess on my screen. I see only this

bild

// Rolf

I also tried exploding the upper beam, then shrinking it, and on one surface (still exploded) I get two different midpoints. :sunglasses:

Fig 1. Midpoint on the upper edge is not the same as midpoint on the lower edge… Cool.
bild

// Rolf

You may have to ‘Shrink’ those trimmed surfaces to get the new mid-points.

I think Pascal did a dupEdge and then turned on the control points for the resulting curves.

This raises an old wish that I still wish for, allow simplifyCrv to work on edges, this is a perfect case for it.

When you do find yourself in a situation like this, where you need to resize a window, or you find you have mis-modled the center, I find SolidPtOn (often with SetPt) is a really handy way to quickly re-position things, especially rectilinear things like a window.

Sam

Ah yes I see. thanks for the hint! Only the smaller cross-strips in the middle needs some more attention.

// Rolf

Hi Sam, Rolf - what we’ll do for now, I think, having just chatted with the devloper, is make MergeEdge and MergeAllEdges simplify co-linear segments into lines. @RIL - do you recall if you used MergeAllEdges on this object? Do you recall what tools you used?

https://mcneel.myjetbrains.com/youtrack/issue/RH-46908

-Pascal

1 Like

It’s way cooler than that. I did so and got two different midpoints. :sunglasses:

// Rolf

Then try ‘Shrink to Edges’ and that should give the same midpoints.

I think I only extruded the side beams (1600mm) vertically from a profile curve, then capped, then rotated a copy, then cut it down to 1200mm.

Unfortunately I cannot remember doing more than that, so trying to recreate the upper beam like that should give the same result, otherwise I don’t remember correctly.

But I did rework the window starting all over, just because I had a mess before that and so I wanted to make it “clean”. Well, I didn’t quite succeed it seems… :wink:

// Rolf

// Rolf

The muntin :slight_smile:

That is an improvement and I would appreciate that, but there are times I would also like to see edges that are split arcs get cleaned up as well.

Sam

Hi Rolf - OK thanks - it would be good to be able to reproduce the process that made a polyline on the edge but meantime, once the fix is in for it, MergeAllEdges should take care of this sort of goofiness… Mid OSnap is doing what it should here, but some part of the process has made a linear edge into a polyline… I can’t tell if that is a bug or not.

-Pascal