Keyboard mapping & the kitten hospital


#1

My rhino V5 appears to have the PGUP & PGDN keys hard-wired to nudge 5 units…!!
There is no entry for those two keys in the keyboard options page, so unless I’ve done something very weird, I assume they have been coded like that…?

The obvious question is why? Please release them, let them go…

Also, PLEASE let the user decide how to map the SPACE bar, and the RIGHT MOUSE button.
I so, So, SO hate how these keys repeat the last command. I really don’t like it. At all.

I fail to understand the logic of hard-coding this kind of stuff. By all means ship the product with whatever key mapping you think best, but why force this on your customers, and not allow them to configure the keyboard as they see fit if they want to?
Its just a piece of software; its not a car or motorbike - no kittens will die or have to go to hospital if I change a key to a different command…

cheers
rabbit


(Pascal Golay) #2

Hi Tony - for PageUp and PageDown, see Options > Modeling aids > Nudge:

-Pascal


#3

Thanks Pascal, but I think you misunderstand me?

I’m not asking about the nudge command - I’m complaining that it seems here that the actual physical Page-UP and Page-DOWN keys are hardwired to nudge 5 units.

I want to remap them to something else, but in the keyboard options page they don’t even appear as available for alteration?

cheers
rabbit


(Pascal Golay) #4

Hi Tony - so the other nudges (arrow keys) are other than 5?

I’m not sure if you want PU/PD to be something other than nudge keys, or if you want them to nudge but some other amount. Depending on the settings at the top of the page I posted, nudging either requires Alt+Key or just Key. This behavior can be reversed in that setting but not otherwise changed… These particular keys can only either nudge or undo/redo view changes. I think is has been this way since Roman times. Am I still missing the point? It is true that none of the nudge/view manipulation keys (Arrows and PageUp/Down) can be modified in Keyboard shortcuts.

-Pascal


#5

Yeah - sorry for the confusion.
I’m not interested in nudge at all - I want PU/PD to be available for other things…

although I was around in roman times (when Jesus Christ had his moment of doubt and pain, made damn sure Pilate washed his hands and sealed his fate…but I digress…) and use the nudge keys very often, Ive never ever used those actual keys at all…

Which is just another example of the problem with hard coding of the keys… why do this?

thanks
rabbit


(Pascal Golay) #6

Hi Tony, I’ll guess/recall that it all started with hard wired view manipulation and no nudges, and nudging was added, maybe in V2… but why these are hard wired is/was presumably to make sure some basic and essential behavior was consistent, but I don’t know for sure.

-Pascal


#7

I suggest that it this kind of thing gets looked at for V6 - it frustrates the hell out of me for sure - just because the Romans did it doesn’t mean we should…
Cheers
Pascal

—Sent from mobile device & email—


(Javier) #8

if you have AutoHotKey you could try https://autohotkey.com/boards/viewtopic.php?t=12249
the keys pgeup-down are mapped to zoom!


(Nathan 'jesterKing' Letwory) #9

I am confident in saying that this won’t get looked at for v6. To support a fully customizable input layer would entail a huge amount of work that isn’t even on the radar…


#10

i agree with rabbit on this, customisation is really important to the detail. there are many options to fulfill customisation in rhino but unfortunately also many keys are blocked. to a satisfying work experience keys like tab for toggling tool windows or anything else or having any other key addressable as wished would really be helpful.

if this is not on the radar i would wish for this to be considered. also having the option setting left or right ctrl, alt or even shift button different would be interesting.


#11

My query is simply that you:

  1. unhook the PU/PD from hard coding, and allow them to be remapped as the user decides (like all the F keys, Home, End) already are.

  2. Unhook the space bar and the right mouse button to allow the same , or at very least allow disabling them from firing the Enter" command.

I don’t see that is asking for “a fully customizable input layer” or that it would “entail a huge amount of work”…?

cheers
rabbit


#12

[quote=“rabbit, post:11, topic:45830, full:true”]
My query is simply that you:

  1. unhook the PU/PD from hard coding, and allow them to be remapped as the user decides (like all the F keys, Home, End) already are. [/quote]

you can do that on Mac (if you first set the nudge keys to option+arrows)… for example. that’s Join via page down key:



that’s possible on Mac too.

if you set right-click to show context menus then it won’t repeat commands. (and actually, iirc, the earlier versions didn’t have this setting… you couldn’t repeat commands on mac with right-mouse button… this preference was added later to be more in line with Windows Rhino)


so maybe just switch OS?

(kidding :wink: )

or maybe these options are also available on Windows?


[edit]
regarding the space bar–
what do you want to change it to? the space bar in Rhino is the same thing as enter key… and to me, it makes sense in a command line driven application because the enter key is off to the side so there’d be a whole lot of reaching across the keyboard with the left hand if spacebar was something else.

but you’d rather it be what, exactly?


#13

Jeff - you the man!

No joy in windows re the PU/PD keys - they are just not available. My nudge is set to the arrowkeys , but it doesn’t release the others.
BUT I noticed in your screen shot that your context menu delay is set to 300 - mine was set to 01. God knows why - but changing it to 300 effectively cancels the repeat command - its still there, but its not so easy to fire it. A sort of workaround…

re the space bar - I’d personally like to map it to “pan”, because that’s what it is in photoshop, and I’ve got used to it.
Surely this is one of the reasons keyboard customization is desirable? - that it allows us to make differing programs that have similar commands work in similar ways…

Now, heres a case in point re differing ways people like to use a program; you prefer the space bar to be “enter”, but I would prefer it to be “pan”. Why is one preference “wrong” and the other “right” (ie hard coded)?

@Nathanletwory - seems like the MAC already does what I’m asking…?

cheers
rabbit


#14

i wouldn’t go as far as saying that :wink:
it just so happens that the two specific points you brought up (pageDown & canceling repeat command) are customizable in Mac for Rhino… but everything in Rhino for mac isn’t like that and there are hardwired controls… (like spacebar as enter & most of the modifier keys usage)


fwiw, the weirdest thing for me to get used to in Rhino was the right mouse button for rotating the model… i always wanted to put that on a thumb-button (or maybe middle mouse button)

i’m used to it now but if the opportunity arose for customization, i’d likely still put it on a different button.


personally, i’d definitely leave spacebar as enter (assuming the fundamentals of using Rhino remained the same).

do you not use the command line & options very often? or Aliases / macros?

if you do, are you pushing the enter key to trigger them? or the spacebar?


#15

I’m very comfortable using the enter key for “enter”. When I started using computers it was labeled “return” - years of use means it’s no problem at all.

When I first came across rhino in its pre-release form I was totally blown away by how effortless it was to navigate in 3D compared to stuff I had been using (3D studio release 2 - which was a very good 3D program especially for its day)
I’m still amazed even now how great it is - I just hate “enter” being spread all over the show…

—Sent from mobile device & email—


#16

it’s called return on Mac.

are you sure you’re using the right computers?
:stuck_out_tongue_winking_eye: