# Is RhinoRender using Cycles?

**URL:** <https://discourse.mcneel.com/t/is-rhinorender-using-cycles/124014>\
**Category:** Rendering\
**Tags:** windows\
**Created:** [May 11, 2021, 7:39am UTC](https://discourse.mcneel.com/t/is-rhinorender-using-cycles/124014 "2021-05-11T07:39:31Z")\
**Posts on this page:** 14\
**Page:** 1

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**Author:** ![ohmarinus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/mcneel/user_avatar/discourse.mcneel.com/ohmarinus/32/485990_2.png) [@ohmarinus](https://discourse.mcneel.com/u/ohmarinus)\
**Post date:** [May 11, 2021, 7:39am UTC](https://discourse.mcneel.com/t/is-rhinorender-using-cycles/124014/1 "2021-05-11T07:39:31Z")

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Hi, I’m a bit confused, been looking for the `Short Questions topic` but couldn’t find it. Anyway, I’m using the latest Rhino 7 and wanted to give Cycles a try.

It’s a bit confusing that I can select cycles in the options, but Cycles isn’t mentioned anywhere else in the program. How do I know if I’m using Cycles? It looks similar to the renderings I make in Blender, but I get no feedback from Rhino whether it’s actually using my GPU for the rendering.

![Screenshot 2021-05-11 091631](https://global.discourse-cdn.com/mcneel/uploads/default/original/4X/a/0/0/a005a4f0f491cc08483eec98d10462a6e7493554.png)

![Screenshot 2021-05-11 091620](https://global.discourse-cdn.com/mcneel/uploads/default/original/4X/3/5/b/35bf011dd955cd53759061e9b3283bebe09f66ca.png)

I’m asking because compared to Blender, rendering even a small image takes quite a long time. Blender just crushes the render times. It would be great to have more options. I’ve been digging through the `Rhino Render Advanced Settings`, but wasn’t able to tune it in a way that gave a good balance between render quality and render time yet.

For example, in the settings, I have `sessions` set to 1000, but when rendering it still does 1500 passes. So I’m wondering if my settings are actually doing anything. And when I choose to do a `Render Preview`, it still just renders the same quality with 1500 passes.

![Screenshot 2021-05-11 093910](https://global.discourse-cdn.com/mcneel/uploads/default/original/4X/4/4/e/44ef459401458da27444736ad62b2286f915da05.png)

Am I doing something wrong?

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**Author:** ![nathanletwory](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/mcneel/user_avatar/discourse.mcneel.com/nathanletwory/32/482880_2.png) [@nathanletwory](https://discourse.mcneel.com/u/nathanletwory)\
**Post date:** [May 11, 2021, 7:55am UTC](https://discourse.mcneel.com/t/is-rhinorender-using-cycles/124014/2 "2021-05-11T07:55:23Z")

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Rhino Render is using Cycles from Rhino 7 onwards.

By default the settings in the render quality drop down are used

![image](https://global.discourse-cdn.com/mcneel/uploads/default/original/4X/6/9/e/69e38251b4830fa5de8a5c4c85c4c7844f911a57.png)

To override those you have to check the Overrride Production Render Quality check box below the session samples count.

> [@ohmarinus](#):
>
> a `Render Preview` , it still just renders the same quality with 1500 passes.

I need to check that, maybe a bug.

> [@ohmarinus](#):
>
> but I get no feedback from Rhino whether it’s actually using my GPU for the rendering.

When using the \_Render command you’ll see this in the top of the render window

![image](https://global.discourse-cdn.com/mcneel/uploads/default/original/4X/c/9/5/c95f218e94190cab9cb1dca73e4b525d7dc41ecf.png)

In the viewport you can click on the word Cycles to see what rendering device is used

![image](https://global.discourse-cdn.com/mcneel/uploads/default/original/4X/c/d/f/cdfbf9edd995c1a735a814f98f03a0db4f500186.png)

> [@ohmarinus](#):
>
> I’m asking because compared to Blender, rendering even a small image takes quite a long time. Blender just crushes the render times

Current Rhino Cycles and current Blender Cycles can’t be compared. We’ve got quite a few changes made to Cycles to fit in Rhino. And our code-base is still older. I hope to upgrade to latest Cycles codebase during the summer.

> [@ohmarinus](#):
>
> It would be great to have more options

Agreed, but that will be something of the future.

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<div class="post-metadata">

**Author:** ![ohmarinus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/mcneel/user_avatar/discourse.mcneel.com/ohmarinus/32/485990_2.png) [@ohmarinus](https://discourse.mcneel.com/u/ohmarinus)\
**Post date:** [May 11, 2021, 8:35am UTC](https://discourse.mcneel.com/t/is-rhinorender-using-cycles/124014/3 "2021-05-11T08:35:06Z")

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Thanks for the awesome reply Nathan. This literally answered all of my questions, and only raised one new question.

> In the viewport you can click on the word Cycles to see what rendering device is used

I somehow don’t see the word Cycles anywhere, where does this word appear? 🙂

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**Author:** ![nathanletwory](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/mcneel/user_avatar/discourse.mcneel.com/nathanletwory/32/482880_2.png) [@nathanletwory](https://discourse.mcneel.com/u/nathanletwory)\
**Post date:** [May 11, 2021, 8:37am UTC](https://discourse.mcneel.com/t/is-rhinorender-using-cycles/124014/4 "2021-05-11T08:37:34Z")

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This is assuming you’re running the Raytraced viewport.

Raytraced and Rhino Render use the very same Cycles engine.

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<div class="post-metadata">

**Author:** ![ohmarinus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/mcneel/user_avatar/discourse.mcneel.com/ohmarinus/32/485990_2.png) [@ohmarinus](https://discourse.mcneel.com/u/ohmarinus)\
**Post date:** [May 11, 2021, 8:42am UTC](https://discourse.mcneel.com/t/is-rhinorender-using-cycles/124014/5 "2021-05-11T08:42:53Z")

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Thanks, that cleared things up! For fast work I use the ‘Rendered’ viewport, actually never touched the raytraced viewport. I’m doing quite a simple render and had not expected it to take over a minute with my RTX2060 card. I can’t wait to see what is coming this summer, good luck with the development!

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<div class="post-metadata">

**Author:** ![nathanletwory](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/mcneel/user_avatar/discourse.mcneel.com/nathanletwory/32/482880_2.png) [@nathanletwory](https://discourse.mcneel.com/u/nathanletwory)\
**Post date:** [May 11, 2021, 8:44am UTC](https://discourse.mcneel.com/t/is-rhinorender-using-cycles/124014/6 "2021-05-11T08:44:55Z")

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Do try one of the denoiser plug-ins available through `_PackageManager` to cut down on render times.

Our Cycles integration does not have denoiser functionality enabled, that is provided separately.

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<div class="post-metadata">

**Author:** ![ohmarinus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/mcneel/user_avatar/discourse.mcneel.com/ohmarinus/32/485990_2.png) [@ohmarinus](https://discourse.mcneel.com/u/ohmarinus)\
**Post date:** [May 11, 2021, 10:08am UTC](https://discourse.mcneel.com/t/is-rhinorender-using-cycles/124014/7 "2021-05-11T10:08:32Z")

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![Screenshot 2021-05-11 120525](https://global.discourse-cdn.com/mcneel/uploads/default/original/4X/e/2/a/e2adbac995b5ad2e2a806fa243ccf7855fc987f1.png)

Thanks to your suggestions I managed to get the rendering time down to around 2 minutes with only 500 passes and the denoiser. If I understand correctly the denoiser allows less passes while maintaining a higher quality image because of post-processing?

Is there a way I can find out if my rendering times are any good? My scene is really simple, no textures, one skylight and one light. I do really like how the renders look nowadays with the new rendered!

I do notice some crispy lines here and there despite rendering at 300dpi:  
 ![Screenshot 2021-05-11 121047](https://global.discourse-cdn.com/mcneel/uploads/default/original/4X/a/3/8/a380aae688d03c43b8263b59048e91d71fa98009.png)

Edit:  
I managed to get away with 15 passes and adding gaussian blur, but I don’t think the edge should be so choppy to begin with.

 ![substrate2_2_denoiser_HR](https://global.discourse-cdn.com/mcneel/uploads/default/original/4X/e/b/8/eb85900b8193f2f8bceea067729353babce4f2e0.png)  
ps I don’t know what’s going wrong with the PNG render, the image shouldn’t look the way it does here on the forums.

Okay, something is going wrong, this is the render preview:

 ![Screenshot 2021-05-11 122651](https://global.discourse-cdn.com/mcneel/uploads/default/original/4X/3/d/9/3d99bd75b522e4bd5a489e7736427c6fa1da4fff.png)

And this is the rendered JPEG file saved on disk:

 ![substrate_2_renderHR](https://global.discourse-cdn.com/mcneel/uploads/default/original/4X/7/b/2/7b289cf2631781093cf6ca2e1f13f684b1aeeae5.jpeg)

It looks like it’s saving the RGBA channel preview instead of the RGB preview 🤔

**Did a little research, and somehow adding gaussian blur 0.60 points makes the image brightness go wild.**  
Bug?

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<div class="post-metadata">

**Author:** ![nathanletwory](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/mcneel/user_avatar/discourse.mcneel.com/nathanletwory/32/482880_2.png) [@nathanletwory](https://discourse.mcneel.com/u/nathanletwory)\
**Post date:** [May 11, 2021, 10:46am UTC](https://discourse.mcneel.com/t/is-rhinorender-using-cycles/124014/8 "2021-05-11T10:46:09Z")

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> [@ohmarinus](#):
>
> he denoiser allows less passes while maintaining a higher quality image because of post-processing?

Correct. In Blender the denoising is integrated a bit more, so it is faster to denoise.

> [@ohmarinus](#):
>
> I don’t think the edge should be so choppy to begin with.

This may be a result of the depth of field post-effect. Does it exist with all post-effects disabled?

> [@ohmarinus](#):
>
> adding gaussian blur 0.60 points makes the image brightness go wild.

What gaussian blur are you referring to?

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<div class="post-metadata">

**Author:** ![ohmarinus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/mcneel/user_avatar/discourse.mcneel.com/ohmarinus/32/485990_2.png) [@ohmarinus](https://discourse.mcneel.com/u/ohmarinus)\
**Post date:** [May 11, 2021, 11:59am UTC](https://discourse.mcneel.com/t/is-rhinorender-using-cycles/124014/9 "2021-05-11T11:59:57Z")

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> [@nathanletwory](#):
>
> This may be a result of the depth of field post-effect. Does it exist with all post-effects disabled?

Absolutely right! Depth of Field adds this, I tried setting the depth slightly behind the edge, but it still appeared elsewhere in that case. I guess the depth of field effect would have to be added manually somehow.

> [@nathanletwory](#):
>
> What gaussian blur are you referring to?

The one I added under `Final Pass`:

![Screenshot 2021-05-11 135733](https://global.discourse-cdn.com/mcneel/uploads/default/original/4X/8/8/1/8813b2540f8af7224a6691f05ea81521d76fc291.png)

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<div class="post-metadata">

**Author:** ![nathanletwory](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/mcneel/user_avatar/discourse.mcneel.com/nathanletwory/32/482880_2.png) [@nathanletwory](https://discourse.mcneel.com/u/nathanletwory)\
**Post date:** [May 11, 2021, 12:29pm UTC](https://discourse.mcneel.com/t/is-rhinorender-using-cycles/124014/10 "2021-05-11T12:29:19Z")

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Instead of doing it as a post-processing effect you could just use actual focal blur - with nothing selected in a Raytraced viewport choose the focal blur tab in the viewport properties page.

> [@ohmarinus](#):
>
> The one I added under `Final Pass`

Ok, I think that is something @DavidEranen worked on.

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<div class="post-metadata">

**Author:** ![nathanletwory](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/mcneel/user_avatar/discourse.mcneel.com/nathanletwory/32/482880_2.png) [@nathanletwory](https://discourse.mcneel.com/u/nathanletwory)\
**Post date:** [May 11, 2021, 8:35pm UTC](https://discourse.mcneel.com/t/is-rhinorender-using-cycles/124014/11 "2021-05-11T20:35:11Z")

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A post was split to a new topic: [Material Setup compared to Flamingo](https://discourse.mcneel.com/t/material-setup-compared-to-flamingo/124064)

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<div class="post-metadata">

**Author:** ![ohmarinus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/mcneel/user_avatar/discourse.mcneel.com/ohmarinus/32/485990_2.png) [@ohmarinus](https://discourse.mcneel.com/u/ohmarinus)\
**Post date:** [May 12, 2021, 9:37am UTC](https://discourse.mcneel.com/t/is-rhinorender-using-cycles/124014/12 "2021-05-12T09:37:23Z")

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Awesome, the raytracing viewport works really well as well.

Just to add, when selecting Gaussian blur in the Raytracing viewport it also blows out all colors:

 ![asitshouldbe](https://global.discourse-cdn.com/mcneel/uploads/default/original/4X/0/0/a/00aad3d2b57f07f33604b2bf259298702e371a28.png)

 ![notasitshouldbe](https://global.discourse-cdn.com/mcneel/uploads/default/original/4X/9/9/1/9917c2e96b994456cadfe42377c40112668632ad.png)

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<div class="post-metadata">

**Author:** ![nathanletwory](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/mcneel/user_avatar/discourse.mcneel.com/nathanletwory/32/482880_2.png) [@nathanletwory](https://discourse.mcneel.com/u/nathanletwory)\
**Post date:** [May 12, 2021, 10:30am UTC](https://discourse.mcneel.com/t/is-rhinorender-using-cycles/124014/13 "2021-05-12T10:30:10Z")

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I’ve logged this error as [RH-64172](https://mcneel.myjetbrains.com/youtrack/issue/RH-64172) _Gaussian Blur causes overexposure effect_.

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<div class="post-metadata">

**Author:** ![brian](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/mcneel/user_avatar/discourse.mcneel.com/brian/32/504171_2.png) [@brian](https://discourse.mcneel.com/u/brian)\
**Post date:** [May 18, 2021, 11:12pm UTC](https://discourse.mcneel.com/t/is-rhinorender-using-cycles/124014/14 "2021-05-18T23:12:04Z")

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[RH-64172](https://mcneel.myjetbrains.com/youtrack/issue/RH-64172) is fixed in the latest [Rhino 7.7 Service Release](https://www.rhino3d.com/download/rhino/7/latest)